Badly organized tours

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Badly organized tours

Deror Avi
The conference tours suffered from lack of organization from the beginning. The tours were poorly organized, badly publicized, not properly described etc.

I have signed up to the NARA conservation lab tour. The description of which included two meeting points - a block apart from each other (one on Pensilvania ave and one on constitution avenue) both of which were wrong - the group met elsewhere resulting in a delay trying to find the participants.

The tour description listed that a photo ID is required and an official one - government one. I thought a driving license (sufficient for driving in the US) with a photo ID suffices but no. After having passed security checks (checking bags and detectors as in airport) And having to wait a bit longer, I was informed that only a passport is acceptable, and denied entrance to the tour, thus waiting a full hour and a half (traveling and waiting) due to the fact that the tour organizer is clueless.

I am not blaming the security staff there- they have their regulations, and need to follow them. But how hard would it be for the organizers to do simple basic homework and ask what is required for a foreign tourist to enter.

And I was not the only wikipedian disallowed from entering, Osama was also kept out.

My recommendation to you all - if this tour is any indication - do not bother to go on any other tours.

Deror

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Re: Badly organized tours

Alhen
I guess you should have your passport with you at all times? Isn't that required?

Alhen

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2012/7/10 Deror <[hidden email]>
The conference tours suffered from lack of organization from the beginning. The tours were poorly organized, badly publicized, not properly described etc.

I have signed up to the NARA conservation lab tour. The description of which included two meeting points - a block apart from each other (one on Pensilvania ave and one on constitution avenue) both of which were wrong - the group met elsewhere resulting in a delay trying to find the participants.

The tour description listed that a photo ID is required and an official one - government one. I thought a driving license (sufficient for driving in the US) with a photo ID suffices but no. After having passed security checks (checking bags and detectors as in airport) And having to wait a bit longer, I was informed that only a passport is acceptable, and denied entrance to the tour, thus waiting a full hour and a half (traveling and waiting) due to the fact that the tour organizer is clueless.

I am not blaming the security staff there- they have their regulations, and need to follow them. But how hard would it be for the organizers to do simple basic homework and ask what is required for a foreign tourist to enter.

And I was not the only wikipedian disallowed from entering, Osama was also kept out.

My recommendation to you all - if this tour is any indication - do not bother to go on any other tours.

Deror

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Re: Badly organized tours

Béria Lima
Well, you need to care a valid ID with you all time, not necessarily your passport.

But then, I lived almost 3 years in Europe and the only times someone asked for my passport was in the airports to get in and out.  ;)
_____
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Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.<span onmouseout="cancel = false; window.setTimeout(WRCHideContent, 1000); clearTimeout(showTimer);" onmouseover=" var self = this; showTimer = window.setTimeout(function(){WRCShowContent({&#39;rating&#39;:{&#39;value&#39;:-1,&#39;weight&#39;:-1},&#39;flags&#39;:{},&#39;single&#39;:true,&#39;ttl&#39;:7200,&#39;expireTime&#39;:&#39;20120709202557&#39;}, self.className)},600);" class="wrc0" style="padding-right:16px;width:16px;height:16px">


On 10 July 2012 22:00, Alhen <[hidden email]> wrote:
I guess you should have your passport with you at all times? Isn't that required?

Alhen

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Promotor de Wikimedia Bolivia
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2012/7/10 Deror <[hidden email]>
The conference tours suffered from lack of organization from the beginning. The tours were poorly organized, badly publicized, not properly described etc.

I have signed up to the NARA conservation lab tour. The description of which included two meeting points - a block apart from each other (one on Pensilvania ave and one on constitution avenue) both of which were wrong - the group met elsewhere resulting in a delay trying to find the participants.

The tour description listed that a photo ID is required and an official one - government one. I thought a driving license (sufficient for driving in the US) with a photo ID suffices but no. After having passed security checks (checking bags and detectors as in airport) And having to wait a bit longer, I was informed that only a passport is acceptable, and denied entrance to the tour, thus waiting a full hour and a half (traveling and waiting) due to the fact that the tour organizer is clueless.

I am not blaming the security staff there- they have their regulations, and need to follow them. But how hard would it be for the organizers to do simple basic homework and ask what is required for a foreign tourist to enter.

And I was not the only wikipedian disallowed from entering, Osama was also kept out.

My recommendation to you all - if this tour is any indication - do not bother to go on any other tours.

Deror

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Re: Badly organized tours

Andrew Lih-2
On Tue, Jul 10, 2012 at 6:23 PM, Béria Lima <[hidden email]> wrote:
Well, you need to care a valid ID with you all time, not necessarily your passport.

But then, I lived almost 3 years in Europe and the only times someone asked for my passport was in the airports to get in and out.  ;)


Unfortunately, in a federal zone like Washington DC, post-9/11, it's more likely you'll be required to show proper ID than for most other places.

I do not know whether this will be the case at the Library of Congress reception tomorrow, but I would bring your passport just to make sure. Let's make sure there's no one standing outside and blocked from this event.

To restate the directions from the Wikimedia DC folks again:

If you will not arrive to Washington, DC in time to pick up your badge but would still like to attend the reception, please email [hidden email] with your name and affiliation, and we will make sure you will be to attend. And please remember to add your name on the event's page, as having an accurate headcount will help us with preparations: http://wikimania2012.wikimedia.org/wiki/Google_Reception

Please note that all guests musts go through Library of Congress security to enter the venue, and, as such, we strongly suggest that you leave large bags and laptops at your hotel/hostel/home. Doing so will make going through security a much faster and smoother process and will give you more time to enjoy the event.

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Re: Badly organized tours

Federico Leva (Nemo)
In reply to this post by Béria Lima
Béria Lima, 11/07/2012 03:23:
> Well, you need to care a valid ID with you all time, not necessarily
> your passport.
>
> But then, I lived almost 3 years in Europe and the only times someone
> asked for my passport was in the airports to get in and out.  ;)

Well, you don't even need the passport if you're flying within Europe.
It's hard to get used to <s>barbaric</s> foreign habits but after all
we've survived Israel...

Nemo

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Re: Badly organized tours

Béria Lima
Oh Frederico, that is only for European citizens, my ID isn't valid in Europe. ;)

But then, I can travel almost all South America without a passport, while you need to carry yours here. ;)
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Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.<span onmouseout="cancel = false; window.setTimeout(WRCHideContent, 1000); clearTimeout(showTimer);" onmouseover=" var self = this; showTimer = window.setTimeout(function(){WRCShowContent({&#39;rating&#39;:{&#39;value&#39;:-1,&#39;weight&#39;:-1},&#39;flags&#39;:{},&#39;single&#39;:true,&#39;ttl&#39;:7200,&#39;expireTime&#39;:&#39;20120709202557&#39;}, self.className)},600);" class="wrc0" style="padding-right:16px;width:16px;height:16px">


On 10 July 2012 22:43, Federico Leva (Nemo) <[hidden email]> wrote:
Béria Lima, 11/07/2012 03:23:

Well, you need to care a valid ID with you all time, not necessarily
your passport.

But then, I lived almost 3 years in Europe and the only times someone
asked for my passport was in the airports to get in and out.  ;)

Well, you don't even need the passport if you're flying within Europe. It's hard to get used to <s>barbaric</s> foreign habits but after all we've survived Israel...

Nemo


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Re: Badly organized tours

Josh Lim
To corroborate what Beria said: I needed to carry my passport with me while traveling around Europe (except within Poland, where I carried my [national] student ID).  And since I was advised not to get a residence permit (stay of less than one year, that's why), it was sometimes hasslesome to convince people that I was staying in Poland.  This most notably happened, for Nemo's sake, in Italy, where I was detained at Fiumicino for around 10-15 minutes while immigration personnel tried to "clarify" my status.

But then again, in Southeast Asia, we need passports to travel even within the region anyway, so we're used to it. :P

Josh
 
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Major in Global Politics, Minor in Chinese Studies
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Vice-President (2011-2012), Wikimedia Philippines
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Member, Ateneo Lingua Ars Cultura

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From: Béria Lima <[hidden email]>
To: Wikimania general list (open subscription) <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2012 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: [Wikimania-l] Badly organized tours

Oh Frederico, that is only for European citizens, my ID isn't valid in Europe. ;)

But then, I can travel almost all South America without a passport, while you need to carry yours here. ;)
_____
Béria Lima

Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.


On 10 July 2012 22:43, Federico Leva (Nemo) <[hidden email]> wrote:
Béria Lima, 11/07/2012 03:23:

Well, you need to care a valid ID with you all time, not necessarily
your passport.

But then, I lived almost 3 years in Europe and the only times someone
asked for my passport was in the airports to get in and out.  ;)

Well, you don't even need the passport if you're flying within Europe. It's hard to get used to <s>barbaric</s> foreign habits but after all we've survived Israel...

Nemo


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Re: Badly organized tours

Federico Leva (Nemo)
Josh Lim, 11/07/2012 04:12:
> To corroborate what Beria said: I needed to carry my passport with me
> while traveling around Europe (except within Poland, where I carried my
> [national] student ID).  And since I was advised not to get a residence
> permit (stay of less than one year, that's why), it was sometimes
> hasslesome to convince people that I was staying in Poland.  This most
> notably happened, for Nemo's sake, in Italy, where I was detained at
> Fiumicino for around 10-15 minutes while immigration personnel tried to
> "clarify" my status.

Well of corse, this discrimination of non-Europeans can't be eliminated
now. :-p And since this is the new track of the thread, I can add that
even for us things can get problematic if you forget the ID in the room
before leaving for the airport as I did in Poland. :D

Nemo

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Re: Badly organized tours

Aude-2
In reply to this post by Josh Lim
No passport or id needed for the Capitol tour  

Not a bad idea to carry your passport around though

Katie

 

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On Jul 10, 2012, at 10:12 PM, Josh Lim <[hidden email]> wrote:

To corroborate what Beria said: I needed to carry my passport with me while traveling around Europe (except within Poland, where I carried my [national] student ID).  And since I was advised not to get a residence permit (stay of less than one year, that's why), it was sometimes hasslesome to convince people that I was staying in Poland.  This most notably happened, for Nemo's sake, in Italy, where I was detained at Fiumicino for around 10-15 minutes while immigration personnel tried to "clarify" my status.

But then again, in Southeast Asia, we need passports to travel even within the region anyway, so we're used to it. :P

Josh
 
JAMES JOSHUA G. LIM
Block I1, AB Political Science
Major in Global Politics, Minor in Chinese Studies
Class of 2013, Ateneo de Manila University
Quezon City, Metro Manila, Philippines

Vice-President (2011-2012), Wikimedia Philippines
Member, Ateneo Debate Society
Member, The Assembly
Member, Ateneo Lingua Ars Cultura

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Friendster/Facebook/Twitter: akiestar | Wikimedia: Sky Harbor
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From: Béria Lima <[hidden email]>
To: Wikimania general list (open subscription) <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2012 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: [Wikimania-l] Badly organized tours

Oh Frederico, that is only for European citizens, my ID isn't valid in Europe. ;)

But then, I can travel almost all South America without a passport, while you need to carry yours here. ;)
_____
Béria Lima

Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.


On 10 July 2012 22:43, Federico Leva (Nemo) <[hidden email]> wrote:
Béria Lima, 11/07/2012 03:23:

Well, you need to care a valid ID with you all time, not necessarily
your passport.

But then, I lived almost 3 years in Europe and the only times someone
asked for my passport was in the airports to get in and out.  ;)

Well, you don't even need the passport if you're flying within Europe. It's hard to get used to <s>barbaric</s> foreign habits but after all we've survived Israel...

Nemo


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Re: Badly organized tours

Michael Peel-4
In contrast to Deror's experience with tours, the tour of the Congressional Cemetery was excellent. No passport needed, and no security checks. ;-)

Mike

On 10 Jul 2012, at 22:24, aude wrote:

No passport or id needed for the Capitol tour  

Not a bad idea to carry your passport around though

Katie

 

Sent from my iPhone

On Jul 10, 2012, at 10:12 PM, Josh Lim <[hidden email]> wrote:

To corroborate what Beria said: I needed to carry my passport with me while traveling around Europe (except within Poland, where I carried my [national] student ID).  And since I was advised not to get a residence permit (stay of less than one year, that's why), it was sometimes hasslesome to convince people that I was staying in Poland.  This most notably happened, for Nemo's sake, in Italy, where I was detained at Fiumicino for around 10-15 minutes while immigration personnel tried to "clarify" my status.

But then again, in Southeast Asia, we need passports to travel even within the region anyway, so we're used to it. :P

Josh
 
JAMES JOSHUA G. LIM
Block I1, AB Political Science
Major in Global Politics, Minor in Chinese Studies
Class of 2013, Ateneo de Manila University
Quezon City, Metro Manila, Philippines

Vice-President (2011-2012), Wikimedia Philippines
Member, Ateneo Debate Society
Member, The Assembly
Member, Ateneo Lingua Ars Cultura

[hidden email] | +63 (927) 531-8301
Friendster/Facebook/Twitter: akiestar | Wikimedia: Sky Harbor
http://akira123323.livejournal.com


From: Béria Lima <[hidden email]>
To: Wikimania general list (open subscription) <[hidden email]>
Sent: Wednesday, July 11, 2012 9:50 AM
Subject: Re: [Wikimania-l] Badly organized tours

Oh Frederico, that is only for European citizens, my ID isn't valid in Europe. ;)

But then, I can travel almost all South America without a passport, while you need to carry yours here. ;)
_____
Béria Lima

Imagine um mundo onde é dada a qualquer pessoa a possibilidade de ter livre acesso ao somatório de todo o conhecimento humano. Ajude-nos a construir esse sonho.


On 10 July 2012 22:43, Federico Leva (Nemo) <[hidden email][hidden email]> wrote:
Béria Lima, 11/07/2012 03:23:

Well, you need to care a valid ID with you all time, not necessarily
your passport.

But then, I lived almost 3 years in Europe and the only times someone
asked for my passport was in the airports to get in and out.  ;)

Well, you don't even need the passport if you're flying within Europe. It's hard to get used to <s>barbaric</s> foreign habits but after all we've survived Israel...

Nemo


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Re: Badly organized tours

Deryck Chan
In reply to this post by Federico Leva (Nemo)

In general, other than flying and buying alcohol etc, no one is requires to carry ID in Europe.

However, advance warning: in Hong Kong, carrying photo-ID with you is mandatory by law for all persons aged 11 or over at all times in public places.

Deryck

On Jul 10, 2012 9:44 PM, "Federico Leva (Nemo)" <[hidden email]> wrote:
Béria Lima, 11/07/2012 03:23:
Well, you need to care a valid ID with you all time, not necessarily
your passport.

But then, I lived almost 3 years in Europe and the only times someone
asked for my passport was in the airports to get in and out.  ;)

Well, you don't even need the passport if you're flying within Europe. It's hard to get used to <s>barbaric</s> foreign habits but after all we've survived Israel...

Nemo

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Re: Badly organized tours

Nathan Awrich


On Tue, Jul 10, 2012 at 11:26 PM, Deryck Chan <[hidden email]> wrote:

In general, other than flying and buying alcohol etc, no one is requires to carry ID in Europe.

However, advance warning: in Hong Kong, carrying photo-ID with you is mandatory by law for all persons aged 11 or over at all times in public places.

Deryck


The same is true in the U.S., but entering federal buildings in Washington D.C. constitutes an exception to the rule. 

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