Copyright and cakes...

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Copyright and cakes...

Richard Symonds-3
Silly question for you all:

Is http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Wikimedia_cake.jpg actually
copyrighted to the WMF as a WMF logo? The cake was made for Wikimedia
UK, so it's technically a derivative work, perhaps...

Any ideas what the copyright status of this should be? Does the author
(Jezhotwells) have the ability to release it under a free licence, if
s/he wishes?

Richard Symonds
Office&  Development Manager
Wikimedia UK
+44 (0) 207 065 0992
--
Wikimedia UK is the operating name of Wiki UK Limited, a Charitable Company
Registered in England and Wales, No: 6741827. Charity No:1144513 Office: 4th Floor, Development House,  56-64 Leonard Street,
London EC2A 4LT.
Wikimedia UK is the local chapter of the Wikimedia Foundation (who operate
Wikipedia, amongst other projects). It is an independent non-profit
organization with no legal control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for
its contents.


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Re: Copyright and cakes...

Lodewijk
The cake designer can only release his/her part of the creative process
under a free license (baking the cake/making the photo). I would suggest to
just specifiy that the logo-part is copyright WMF, the photographic and
cake-baking component to be released under CC-BY (not -SA to avoid the SA
clause to make things complicated). That way everyone with permission of
the WMF can reuse the design if wanted.

Lodewijk

No dia 5 de Março de 2012 15:54, Richard Symonds <
[hidden email]> escreveu:

> Silly question for you all:
>
> Is http://commons.wikimedia.org/**wiki/File:Wikimedia_cake.jpg<http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Wikimedia_cake.jpg>actually copyrighted to the WMF as a WMF logo? The cake was made for
> Wikimedia UK, so it's technically a derivative work, perhaps...
>
> Any ideas what the copyright status of this should be? Does the author
> (Jezhotwells) have the ability to release it under a free licence, if s/he
> wishes?
>
> Richard Symonds
> Office&  Development Manager
> Wikimedia UK
> +44 (0) 207 065 0992
> --
> Wikimedia UK is the operating name of Wiki UK Limited, a Charitable Company
> Registered in England and Wales, No: 6741827. Charity No:1144513 Office:
> 4th Floor, Development House,  56-64 Leonard Street,
> London EC2A 4LT.
> Wikimedia UK is the local chapter of the Wikimedia Foundation (who operate
> Wikipedia, amongst other projects). It is an independent non-profit
> organization with no legal control over Wikipedia nor responsibility for
> its contents.
>
>
> ______________________________**_________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> [hidden email].**org <[hidden email]>
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/**mailman/listinfo/foundation-l<https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l>
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Re: Copyright and cakes...

geni
In reply to this post by Richard Symonds-3
On 5 March 2012 14:54, Richard Symonds <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Silly question for you all:
>
> Is http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Wikimedia_cake.jpg actually
> copyrighted to the WMF as a WMF logo? The cake was made for Wikimedia UK, so
> it's technically a derivative work, perhaps...

Its a derivative work. Technically the cake is a copyvio.


> Any ideas what the copyright status of this should be?

The one it is tagged under is about as close as commons could get.

> Does the author
> (Jezhotwells) have the ability to release it under a free licence, if s/he
> wishes?

No but if they put it on permanent display in a public place the photo
would probably be totally fine under UK freedom of panorama law.

--
geni

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Re: Copyright and cakes...

Chris Keating-2
>
>
>
> > Does the author
> > (Jezhotwells) have the ability to release it under a free licence, if
> s/he
> > wishes?
>
> No but if they put it on permanent display in a public place the photo
> would probably be totally fine under UK freedom of panorama law.


I suspect a court would hold that the set of "cakes" is disjoint from the
set of "objects on permanent display", and thus that a photograph of cake
can never benefit from freedom of panorama.

 #nomnomnomnomnom

Chris
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Re: Copyright and cakes...

Thomas Dalton
In reply to this post by geni
On 5 March 2012 20:22, geni <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On 5 March 2012 14:54, Richard Symonds <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Silly question for you all:
>>
>> Is http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Wikimedia_cake.jpg actually
>> copyrighted to the WMF as a WMF logo? The cake was made for Wikimedia UK, so
>> it's technically a derivative work, perhaps...
>
> Its a derivative work. Technically the cake is a copyvio.

It was made for WMUK and WMUK has standing permission to use the logo
for certain purposes, which could probably be interpreted as including
cakes. Therefore, I don't think the cake is a copyvio.

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Re: Copyright and cakes...

Mike Christie
In reply to this post by Chris Keating-2
On Mon, Mar 5, 2012 at 3:40 PM, Chris Keating <[hidden email]>wrote:

> I suspect a court would hold that the set of "cakes" is disjoint from the
> set of "objects on permanent display", and thus that a photograph of cake
> can never benefit from freedom of panorama.
>

You mean we can't have the cake and eat it too?

Mike
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Re: Copyright and cakes...

Chris Keating-2
On Mon, Mar 5, 2012 at 8:45 PM, Mike Christie <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Mon, Mar 5, 2012 at 3:40 PM, Chris Keating <[hidden email]
> >wrote:
>
> > I suspect a court would hold that the set of "cakes" is disjoint from the
> > set of "objects on permanent display", and thus that a photograph of cake
> > can never benefit from freedom of panorama.
> >
>
> You mean we can't have the cake and eat it too?


That's another corollary ;-)
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Re: Copyright and cakes...

geni
In reply to this post by Chris Keating-2
On 5 March 2012 20:40, Chris Keating <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I suspect a court would hold that the set of "cakes" is disjoint from the
> set of "objects on permanent display", and thus that a photograph of cake
> can never benefit from freedom of panorama.

Well you say that but slices of Charles and Diana's wedding cake have
turned up at auction as recently as 2008.



--
geni

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Re: Copyright and cakes...

David Gerard-2
On 5 March 2012 22:07, geni <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On 5 March 2012 20:40, Chris Keating <[hidden email]> wrote:

>> I suspect a court would hold that the set of "cakes" is disjoint from the
>> set of "objects on permanent display", and thus that a photograph of cake
>> can never benefit from freedom of panorama.

> Well you say that but slices of Charles and Diana's wedding cake have
> turned up at auction as recently as 2008.


I wonder how many cakes you would have if you assembled all the fragments.


- d.

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Re: Copyright and cakes...

Lodewijk
eating the cake would damage the moral rights of the logo author. Since he
cannot give general permission to violate moral rights, eating the cake
would be illegal.

No dia 5 de Março de 2012 23:08, David Gerard <[hidden email]> escreveu:

> On 5 March 2012 22:07, geni <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > On 5 March 2012 20:40, Chris Keating <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> >> I suspect a court would hold that the set of "cakes" is disjoint from
> the
> >> set of "objects on permanent display", and thus that a photograph of
> cake
> >> can never benefit from freedom of panorama.
>
> > Well you say that but slices of Charles and Diana's wedding cake have
> > turned up at auction as recently as 2008.
>
>
> I wonder how many cakes you would have if you assembled all the fragments.
>
>
> - d.
>
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Re: Copyright and cakes...

Thomas Dalton
On 5 March 2012 23:14, Lodewijk <[hidden email]> wrote:
> eating the cake would damage the moral rights of the logo author. Since he
> cannot give general permission to violate moral rights, eating the cake
> would be illegal.

If you take a slice out of the cake, that could be an issue since you
have created a new work that negatively portrays the logo. I think the
only option is the eat the entire cake at once.

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Re: Copyright and cakes...

Michael Peel-4
Best all around to simply destroy the evidence (by eating it?).

... can this topic end now? Or be moved on-wiki so that it can be filed under WP:SILLY?

Thanks,
Mike

On 5 Mar 2012, at 23:23, Thomas Dalton wrote:

> On 5 March 2012 23:14, Lodewijk <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> eating the cake would damage the moral rights of the logo author. Since he
>> cannot give general permission to violate moral rights, eating the cake
>> would be illegal.
>
> If you take a slice out of the cake, that could be an issue since you
> have created a new work that negatively portrays the logo. I think the
> only option is the eat the entire cake at once.
>
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
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Re: Copyright and cakes...

Mike Christie
You're right, the topic is done. Filing it under WP:SILLY would be the
icing on the cake.

On Mon, Mar 5, 2012 at 6:30 PM, Michael Peel
<[hidden email]>wrote:

> Best all around to simply destroy the evidence (by eating it?).
>
> ... can this topic end now? Or be moved on-wiki so that it can be filed
> under WP:SILLY?
>
> Thanks,
> Mike
>
> On 5 Mar 2012, at 23:23, Thomas Dalton wrote:
>
> > On 5 March 2012 23:14, Lodewijk <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> eating the cake would damage the moral rights of the logo author. Since
> he
> >> cannot give general permission to violate moral rights, eating the cake
> >> would be illegal.
> >
> > If you take a slice out of the cake, that could be an issue since you
> > have created a new work that negatively portrays the logo. I think the
> > only option is the eat the entire cake at once.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
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>
>
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