Drafts extension in testing

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Drafts extension in testing

Brion Vibber-3
Ok, things are finally starting to normalize as far as getting away from
fundraiser craziness, preparing regular releases, and generally getting
on with making things better for users!

I've enabled the Drafts extension for testing on
http://test.wikipedia.org -- this little cutie was new staff dev Trevor
Parscal's first assignment here, but deployment got pushed back when we
went full-steam on fundraiser banner stuff.


I've written up a quickie blog post with some purty screen shots:

http://leuksman.com/log/2009/01/16/drafts-extension-enabled-on-test-wikipedia/


Suggestions for improvements to the UI and workflow are always welcome!

-- brion

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Sylvain Brunerie
 Very good idea! :)

— Sylvain Brunerie
[[w:fr:User:Delhovlyn]]
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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Magnus Manske-2
In reply to this post by Brion Vibber-3
Great! Share a Wikipedia account with friends/conspirators/fellow
terrorists, and leave them secret messages on Wikipedia that only they
can read. And it will self-destruct after a month! I can see Jack
Bauer coming through the door in 3, 2, 1...  ;-)

Magnus



On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 12:38 AM, Brion Vibber <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Ok, things are finally starting to normalize as far as getting away from
> fundraiser craziness, preparing regular releases, and generally getting
> on with making things better for users!
>
> I've enabled the Drafts extension for testing on
> http://test.wikipedia.org -- this little cutie was new staff dev Trevor
> Parscal's first assignment here, but deployment got pushed back when we
> went full-steam on fundraiser banner stuff.
>
>
> I've written up a quickie blog post with some purty screen shots:
>
> http://leuksman.com/log/2009/01/16/drafts-extension-enabled-on-test-wikipedia/
>
>
> Suggestions for improvements to the UI and workflow are always welcome!
>
> -- brion
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Jackey Tse
can't save summary?

2009/1/18 Magnus Manske <[hidden email]>

> Great! Share a Wikipedia account with friends/conspirators/fellow
> terrorists, and leave them secret messages on Wikipedia that only they
> can read. And it will self-destruct after a month! I can see Jack
> Bauer coming through the door in 3, 2, 1...  ;-)
>
> Magnus
>
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 12:38 AM, Brion Vibber <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> > Ok, things are finally starting to normalize as far as getting away from
> > fundraiser craziness, preparing regular releases, and generally getting
> > on with making things better for users!
> >
> > I've enabled the Drafts extension for testing on
> > http://test.wikipedia.org -- this little cutie was new staff dev Trevor
> > Parscal's first assignment here, but deployment got pushed back when we
> > went full-steam on fundraiser banner stuff.
> >
> >
> > I've written up a quickie blog post with some purty screen shots:
> >
> >
> http://leuksman.com/log/2009/01/16/drafts-extension-enabled-on-test-wikipedia/
> >
> >
> > Suggestions for improvements to the UI and workflow are always welcome!
> >
> > -- brion
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>



--
Jackey Tse | skjackey_tse | Web Developer | 在.hk <http://xn--3ds.hk> (
xn--3ds.hk)
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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Gregory Maxwell
In reply to this post by Magnus Manske-2
On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 11:00 AM, Magnus Manske
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> Great! Share a Wikipedia account with friends/conspirators/fellow
> terrorists, and leave them secret messages on Wikipedia that only they
> can read. And it will self-destruct after a month! I can see Jack
> Bauer coming through the door in 3, 2, 1...  ;-)

Meh. People have already smuggled content in commons uploads unnoticed
for enormous spans of time... this seems less harmful (and given the
size limits, less useful)

Although the problem could be avoided for drafts by using browser
local storage for the data, or requiring some cookie as a key.

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Aryeh Gregor
On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 9:50 PM, Gregory Maxwell <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Although the problem could be avoided for drafts by using browser
> local storage for the data, or requiring some cookie as a key.

Which kind of kills the "save progress at home and continue at work"
use-case, for no very good reason.  I don't think we care if people
use Wikipedia as a private datastore.  If they really felt like it,
they could dump stuff somewhere in their preferences, their signature
or something (do we actually validate that 255-char limit on the
server side?).  When people make a WikipediaDraftFS, then we can start
to take action.

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Soxred93@gmail.com
In reply to this post by Brion Vibber-3
After trying it out on testwikipedia, I am very impressed. This is a  
feature I have long been waiting for, and it's finally a reality. :)  
Is there an estimate as to when this may go live on WMF servers?

Soxred93/X!

On Jan 16, 2009, at 7:38 PM [Jan 16, 2009 ], Brion Vibber wrote:

> Ok, things are finally starting to normalize as far as getting away  
> from
> fundraiser craziness, preparing regular releases, and generally  
> getting
> on with making things better for users!
>
> I've enabled the Drafts extension for testing on
> http://test.wikipedia.org -- this little cutie was new staff dev  
> Trevor
> Parscal's first assignment here, but deployment got pushed back  
> when we
> went full-steam on fundraiser banner stuff.
>
>
> I've written up a quickie blog post with some purty screen shots:
>
> http://leuksman.com/log/2009/01/16/drafts-extension-enabled-on-test- 
> wikipedia/
>
>
> Suggestions for improvements to the UI and workflow are always  
> welcome!
>
> -- brion
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l


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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Casey Brown-3
On Sat, Jan 17, 2009 at 10:16 PM, Soxred93 <[hidden email]> wrote:
> After trying it out on testwikipedia, I am very impressed. This is a
> feature I have long been waiting for, and it's finally a reality. :)
> Is there an estimate as to when this may go live on WMF servers?
>

per brion in previous issues: "when it's ready"? :-)

--
Casey Brown
Cbrown1023

---
Note:  This e-mail address is used for mailing lists.  Personal emails sent to
this address will probably get lost.

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Marco Schuster-2
In reply to this post by Aryeh Gregor
On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 4:03 AM, Aryeh Gregor
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> do we actually validate that 255-char limit on the server side?

Yes, at least MySQL forces us to AFAIR.
Anyway, you can bypass it by creating e.g. User:XY/sig.js and then put
{{subst:User:XY/sig.js}} in your signature field.

Marco

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Aryeh Gregor
On Sun, Jan 18, 2009 at 5:56 AM, Marco Schuster
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> Yes, at least MySQL forces us to AFAIR.

No, the sig is just part of user_options, which is a BLOB.  However,
we do validate the length in SpecialPreferences.php.

> Anyway, you can bypass it by creating e.g. User:XY/sig.js and then put
> {{subst:User:XY/sig.js}} in your signature field.

My point was that you could store information *privately* already.
But it really doesn't matter, since we have no reason to care if a few
people use drafts to save private info.

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Brion Vibber-3
In reply to this post by Jackey Tse
On 1/17/09 6:44 PM, Jackey Tse wrote:
> can't save summary?

Should work. Does it behave differently to what you expect?

-- brion

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Jim Higson-2
In reply to this post by Brion Vibber-3
[hidden email] wrote on 17/01/2009 00:38:38:

> Ok, things are finally starting to normalize as far as getting away from

> fundraiser craziness, preparing regular releases, and generally getting
> on with making things better for users!
>
> I've enabled the Drafts extension for testing on
> http://test.wikipedia.org -- this little cutie was new staff dev Trevor
> Parscal's first assignment here, but deployment got pushed back when we
> went full-steam on fundraiser banner stuff.
>
>
> I've written up a quickie blog post with some purty screen shots:
>
>
http://leuksman.com/log/2009/01/16/drafts-extension-enabled-on-test-wikipedia/
>
>
> Suggestions for improvements to the UI and workflow are always welcome!


Is there an API for getting/saving the draft edits?

--
Jim Higson
Web CMS Developer
BSP, University of Oxford
tel: 01865 2 80691


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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Brion Vibber-3
On Jan 20, 2009, at 2:15, Jim Higson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> [hidden email] wrote on 17/01/2009 00:38:38:
>>
>>
>> Suggestions for improvements to the UI and workflow are always  
>> welcome!
>
>
> Is there an API for getting/saving the draft edits?

Not currently, but that'd be a great thing to have for third-party  
editing tools.

-- Brion

>
>
> --
> Jim Higson
> Web CMS Developer
> BSP, University of Oxford
> tel: 01865 2 80691
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Roan Kattouw
Brion Vibber schreef:

> On Jan 20, 2009, at 2:15, Jim Higson <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>  
>> [hidden email] wrote on 17/01/2009 00:38:38:
>>    
>>> Suggestions for improvements to the UI and workflow are always  
>>> welcome!
>>>      
>> Is there an API for getting/saving the draft edits?
>>    
>
> Not currently, but that'd be a great thing to have for third-party  
> editing tools.
I'll put it on my TODO list, which means I hope to finish it this month
(my TODO list has grown considerably lately).

Roan Kattouw (Catrope)

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Trevor Parscal-2
In reply to this post by Brion Vibber-3
It seems to me that the Drafts extension provides a neat feature with
the potential to save data from being lost by accident in many cases. It
also seems like adding a per-user setting to enable/disable it would be
trivial and also useful for the few (or perhaps many) users who may find
it worth disabling. Additionally the addition of a disable / enable
setting would not detract from the features or fuxtionality of the
extension. Finally it may be less offensive, especially to our avid
contributors, to add a new optional feature rather than a mandatory one.

Since the features of the extension are disabled for unregistered users
already, adding such a setting would truly be a matter of adding a few
more lines of code in a few very obvious places.

Additionally it may be useful (or at least interesting) to be able to
study the statistics of how many / what kind of editors really do
disable the extension - as it may be a fair metric on how likely
different kinds of users are to accept (or reject) modifications to the
editing process. These studies may help to make future feature
enhancements more successful and less alienating.

Does anyone actually object to the addition of a disable drafts feature?

- Trevor

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Aryeh Gregor
On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Trevor Parscal <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Since the features of the extension are disabled for unregistered users
> already

Is this a design decision, or just to simplify implementation?  You
could use a cookie or something, but if you did that you'd have to
make sure Squid doesn't serve pages differently because of it.

> Does anyone actually object to the addition of a disable drafts feature?

Yes.  For virtually any feature imaginable, there will be some
minority of users who don't like it.  That does not imply that we
should add a user preference to disable every single feature we add.
Every extra user preference clutters up the user preferences screen,
making it harder to use; and adds more code paths, making bugs harder
to track down.

In this case, as far as I can tell, the only thing disabling the
feature for a given user would do is hide one button from the UI.  We
already have a mechanism by which users can do things like that if
they really care: they can use a CSS rule in their user stylesheet.
Or, they could just ignore the button, which doesn't seem like an
excessive hardship.  If the extension is adding lots of annoying
interface elements when the user actually has no drafts saved, that's
possibly a problem that should be fixed for all users of the
extension.

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Platonides
Aryeh Gregor wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 1:49 PM, Trevor Parscal <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Since the features of the extension are disabled for unregistered users
>> already
>
> Is this a design decision, or just to simplify implementation?  You
> could use a cookie or something, but if you did that you'd have to
> make sure Squid doesn't serve pages differently because of it.

I don't think it would be wise to add that for anonymous users.
People could be seeing drafts from other people and we would be unable
to assist or even verify reports of things that people see that their
coworkers are writing.

They could benefit from drafts, but in that case better to do it on the
browser itself. IMHO we still need some kind of saving into firefox
storage, for cases like a read-only db. Instead of 'You can't save, the
site is read-only'->'Save-draft'->'No, you can't, the db is read-only',
'You can't save, the site is read-only'->'Save-draft'->'The site is
read-only, the draft has been saved into your browser'.


A completely different approach could be to allow anyone to view other's
drafts. As a new feature, it could be accepted as it is, without
treating it as a completely privacy section. Normal wikipedians won't
mind of people seeing the article as they're writing in. However, the
auto-save-draft may conflict with it.


BTW, the discard link should go via $wgScriptPath not $wgArticlePath
Doing this could lead to eg. search ngines following those links
(although not likely to cause problems for *this* extension)


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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Aryeh Gregor
On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 4:40 PM, Platonides <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I don't think it would be wise to add that for anonymous users.
> People could be seeing drafts from other people and we would be unable
> to assist or even verify reports of things that people see that their
> coworkers are writing.

So?

> They could benefit from drafts, but in that case better to do it on the
> browser itself.

I don't see a practical difference between that and using cookies here
(except, e.g., DB read-only).

> IMHO we still need some kind of saving into firefox
> storage, for cases like a read-only db. Instead of 'You can't save, the
> site is read-only'->'Save-draft'->'No, you can't, the db is read-only',
> 'You can't save, the site is read-only'->'Save-draft'->'The site is
> read-only, the draft has been saved into your browser'.

This can be done in cutting-edge browsers using HTML5's localStorage
and sessionStorage.

> A completely different approach could be to allow anyone to view other's
> drafts. As a new feature, it could be accepted as it is, without
> treating it as a completely privacy section. Normal wikipedians won't
> mind of people seeing the article as they're writing in. However, the
> auto-save-draft may conflict with it.

I'd be completely behind this, now that you mention it.  It's like how
we don't allow private discussions between users (except by e-mail,
okay).  We should be encouraging transparency at every step of using
the software.

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Brion Vibber-3
In reply to this post by Platonides
On 1/20/09 1:40 PM, Platonides wrote:
> They could benefit from drafts, but in that case better to do it on the
> browser itself. IMHO we still need some kind of saving into firefox
> storage, for cases like a read-only db. Instead of 'You can't save, the
> site is read-only'->'Save-draft'->'No, you can't, the db is read-only',
> 'You can't save, the site is read-only'->'Save-draft'->'The site is
> read-only, the draft has been saved into your browser'.

Client-side storage would be fantastic (and avoid unnecessary server
round-trips). We discussed this in original planning but didn't get
round to implementing it yet.

> A completely different approach could be to allow anyone to view other's
> drafts. As a new feature, it could be accepted as it is, without
> treating it as a completely privacy section. Normal wikipedians won't
> mind of people seeing the article as they're writing in. However, the
> auto-save-draft may conflict with it.

I wouldn't be comfortable with that, especially for discussion pages. I
also wouldn't be comfortable with my e-mail client showing everybody my
drafts of my e-mails...

I'm sure I'm not the only one who sometimes writes things they delete
for a very good reason before pushing save. ;)

-- brion

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Re: Drafts extension in testing

Chad
Veeeerrrrry bad idea. I can already see enwiki having
ArbCom cases about stuff someone wanted to say but
didnt .

-Chad

On Jan 20, 2009 5:50 PM, "Brion Vibber" <[hidden email]> wrote:

On 1/20/09 1:40 PM, Platonides wrote: > They could benefit from drafts, but
in that case better to d...
Client-side storage would be fantastic (and avoid unnecessary server
round-trips). We discussed this in original planning but didn't get
round to implementing it yet.

> A completely different approach could be to allow anyone to view other's >
drafts. As a new featu...
I wouldn't be comfortable with that, especially for discussion pages. I
also wouldn't be comfortable with my e-mail client showing everybody my
drafts of my e-mails...

I'm sure I'm not the only one who sometimes writes things they delete
for a very good reason before pushing save. ;)

-- brion

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