Dynamic search results as category pages

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
17 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Dynamic search results as category pages

Yuri Astrakhan-2
Hi, I am thinking of implementing a

#CATQUERY <query>

magic keyword for the category pages.

When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.

For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
quickly redefined as
a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:

#CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher

Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate queries,
including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Brian Wolff
On Jan 24, 2014 1:54 AM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
>
> #CATQUERY <query>
>
> magic keyword for the category pages.
>
> When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
> against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
> result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
>
> For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
> quickly redefined as
> a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
>
> #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
>
> Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate
queries,
> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

I like the idea in principle, but think the syntax could use bikeshedding ;)

If we use this as category pages, im a little worried that people could get
confused and try to add [[category:Greek philosophers]] to a page, and
expect it to work. We would need good error handling in that situation

> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)

Cool. I didnt realize search would support this. That's a pretty big deal
since people expect there categorirs alphabetized.

Another cool project would be to expand intersection/Dyanamic Page List
(Wikimedia) to be able to use search as a different backend (however, that
extension would need quite a bit of refactoring to get there)

-bawolff
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Nikolas Everett


Sent from my iPhone

> On Jan 24, 2014, at 7:55 AM, Brian Wolff <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On Jan 24, 2014 1:54 AM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
>>
>> #CATQUERY <query>
>>
>> magic keyword for the category pages.
>>
>> When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
>> against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
>> result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
>>
>> For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
>> quickly redefined as
>> a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
>>
>> #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
>>
>> Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate
> queries,
>> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikitech-l mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
> I like the idea in principle, but think the syntax could use bikeshedding ;)
>
> If we use this as category pages, im a little worried that people could get
> confused and try to add [[category:Greek philosophers]] to a page, and
> expect it to work. We would need good error handling in that situation


Also, at least at first, you couldn't use one of these synthetic categories to filter search results so you couldn't use them to build other synthetic categories.
>
>> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
>
> Cool. I didnt realize search would support this. That's a pretty big deal
> since people expect there categorirs alphabetized.

So I looked into it and it would be easy to implement with Cirrus _but_ I'm not yet sure about the memory implications. We have a ton of headroom on memory now so it might not matter but I need to test it before I can be as confident that it is ok as I was last night at 1am. It may have caveats like synthetic categories must be less than 1000 articles or not all results are included.


>
> Another cool project would be to expand intersection/Dyanamic P age List
> (Wikimedia) to be able to use search as a different backend (however, that
> extension would need quite a bit of refactoring to get there)
>
> -bawolff
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Brad Jorsch (Anomie)
On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 9:20 AM, Nik Everett <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> > On Jan 24, 2014, at 7:55 AM, Brian Wolff <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > If we use this as category pages, im a little worried that people could
> get
> > confused and try to add [[category:Greek philosophers]] to a page, and
> > expect it to work. We would need good error handling in that situation
>
> Also, at least at first, you couldn't use one of these synthetic
> categories to filter search results so you couldn't use them to build other
> synthetic categories.
>

Don't forget the API. You'd probably need to bascally override
ApiQueryCategoryMembers to check cmtitle and either use parent::run() or a
custom implementation.

--
Brad Jorsch (Anomie)
Software Engineer
Wikimedia Foundation


On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 9:20 AM, Nik Everett <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
> Sent from my iPhone
>
> > On Jan 24, 2014, at 7:55 AM, Brian Wolff <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> On Jan 24, 2014 1:54 AM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
> >>
> >> #CATQUERY <query>
> >>
> >> magic keyword for the category pages.
> >>
> >> When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
> >> against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
> >> result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
> >>
> >> For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
> >> quickly redefined as
> >> a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
> >>
> >> #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
> >>
> >> Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate
> > queries,
> >> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Wikitech-l mailing list
> >> [hidden email]
> >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> > I like the idea in principle, but think the syntax could use
> bikeshedding ;)
> >
> > If we use this as category pages, im a little worried that people could
> get
> > confused and try to add [[category:Greek philosophers]] to a page, and
> > expect it to work. We would need good error handling in that situation
>
>
> Also, at least at first, you couldn't use one of these synthetic
> categories to filter search results so you couldn't use them to build other
> synthetic categories.
> >
> >> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
> >
> > Cool. I didnt realize search would support this. That's a pretty big deal
> > since people expect there categorirs alphabetized.
>
> So I looked into it and it would be easy to implement with Cirrus _but_
> I'm not yet sure about the memory implications. We have a ton of headroom
> on memory now so it might not matter but I need to test it before I can be
> as confident that it is ok as I was last night at 1am. It may have caveats
> like synthetic categories must be less than 1000 articles or not all
> results are included.
>
>
> >
> > Another cool project would be to expand intersection/Dyanamic P age List
> > (Wikimedia) to be able to use search as a different backend (however,
> that
> > extension would need quite a bit of refactoring to get there)
> >
> > -bawolff
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>



--
Brad Jorsch (Anomie)
Software Engineer
Wikimedia Foundation
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

thingles
In reply to this post by Brian Wolff
You could do something exactly like this very, very easily using Semantic MediaWiki and Concepts.
Jamie Thingelstad
[hidden email]
mobile: 612-810-3699
find me on AIM Twitter Facebook LinkedIn

On Jan 24, 2014, at 9:55 AM, Brian Wolff <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Jan 24, 2014 1:54 AM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
>>
>> #CATQUERY <query>
>>
>> magic keyword for the category pages.
>>
>> When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
>> against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
>> result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
>>
>> For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
>> quickly redefined as
>> a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
>>
>> #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
>>
>> Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate
> queries,
>> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikitech-l mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
> I like the idea in principle, but think the syntax could use bikeshedding ;)
>
> If we use this as category pages, im a little worried that people could get
> confused and try to add [[category:Greek philosophers]] to a page, and
> expect it to work. We would need good error handling in that situation
>
>> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
>
> Cool. I didnt realize search would support this. That's a pretty big deal
> since people expect there categorirs alphabetized.
>
> Another cool project would be to expand intersection/Dyanamic Page List
> (Wikimedia) to be able to use search as a different backend (however, that
> extension would need quite a bit of refactoring to get there)
>
> -bawolff
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Yuri Astrakhan-2
Of course - I am actually modeling this feature on Semantic MW. It's just
that I doubt WMF will enable SMW on the cluster any time soon :)


On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 4:13 PM, Jamie Thingelstad <[hidden email]>wrote:

> You could do something exactly like this very, very easily using Semantic
> MediaWiki and Concepts.
> Jamie Thingelstad
> [hidden email]
> mobile: 612-810-3699
> find me on AIM Twitter Facebook LinkedIn
>
> On Jan 24, 2014, at 9:55 AM, Brian Wolff <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > On Jan 24, 2014 1:54 AM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
> >>
> >> #CATQUERY <query>
> >>
> >> magic keyword for the category pages.
> >>
> >> When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
> >> against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
> >> result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
> >>
> >> For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
> >> quickly redefined as
> >> a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
> >>
> >> #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
> >>
> >> Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate
> > queries,
> >> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Wikitech-l mailing list
> >> [hidden email]
> >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> > I like the idea in principle, but think the syntax could use
> bikeshedding ;)
> >
> > If we use this as category pages, im a little worried that people could
> get
> > confused and try to add [[category:Greek philosophers]] to a page, and
> > expect it to work. We would need good error handling in that situation
> >
> >> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
> >
> > Cool. I didnt realize search would support this. That's a pretty big deal
> > since people expect there categorirs alphabetized.
> >
> > Another cool project would be to expand intersection/Dyanamic Page List
> > (Wikimedia) to be able to use search as a different backend (however,
> that
> > extension would need quite a bit of refactoring to get there)
> >
> > -bawolff
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Gerard Meijssen-3
Hoi,
Did you consider the use of Wikidata in stead of SMW? It should not only
indicate all the articles that have the appropriate statements but also the
articles written in other languages.
Thanks,
     GerardM


On 26 January 2014 03:25, Yuri Astrakhan <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Of course - I am actually modeling this feature on Semantic MW. It's just
> that I doubt WMF will enable SMW on the cluster any time soon :)
>
>
> On Sat, Jan 25, 2014 at 4:13 PM, Jamie Thingelstad <[hidden email]
> >wrote:
>
> > You could do something exactly like this very, very easily using Semantic
> > MediaWiki and Concepts.
> > Jamie Thingelstad
> > [hidden email]
> > mobile: 612-810-3699
> > find me on AIM Twitter Facebook LinkedIn
> >
> > On Jan 24, 2014, at 9:55 AM, Brian Wolff <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > On Jan 24, 2014 1:54 AM, "Yuri Astrakhan" <[hidden email]>
> > wrote:
> > >>
> > >> Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
> > >>
> > >> #CATQUERY <query>
> > >>
> > >> magic keyword for the category pages.
> > >>
> > >> When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
> > >> against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and
> show
> > >> result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
> > >>
> > >> For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
> > >> quickly redefined as
> > >> a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
> > >>
> > >> #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
> > >>
> > >> Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate
> > > queries,
> > >> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Wikitech-l mailing list
> > >> [hidden email]
> > >> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> > >
> > > I like the idea in principle, but think the syntax could use
> > bikeshedding ;)
> > >
> > > If we use this as category pages, im a little worried that people could
> > get
> > > confused and try to add [[category:Greek philosophers]] to a page, and
> > > expect it to work. We would need good error handling in that situation
> > >
> > >> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
> > >
> > > Cool. I didnt realize search would support this. That's a pretty big
> deal
> > > since people expect there categorirs alphabetized.
> > >
> > > Another cool project would be to expand intersection/Dyanamic Page List
> > > (Wikimedia) to be able to use search as a different backend (however,
> > that
> > > extension would need quite a bit of refactoring to get there)
> > >
> > > -bawolff
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > > [hidden email]
> > > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Lydia Pintscher
In reply to this post by Yuri Astrakhan-2
On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 10:53 AM, Yuri Astrakhan
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
>
> #CATQUERY <query>
>
> magic keyword for the category pages.
>
> When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
> against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
> result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
>
> For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
> quickly redefined as
> a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
>
> #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
>
> Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate queries,
> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)

In the future this will be possible using Wikidata and queries. My
dream is that categories will to a very large extend go away then and
be replaced with better Wikidata-based tools. I'd _really_ like us not
to introduce more incentives to use categories like this one. Also
it'd be quite a source for confusion to have both.


Cheers
Lydia

--
Lydia Pintscher - http://about.me/lydia.pintscher
Product Manager for Wikidata

Wikimedia Deutschland e.V.
Tempelhofer Ufer 23-24
10963 Berlin
www.wikimedia.de

Wikimedia Deutschland - Gesellschaft zur Förderung Freien Wissens e. V.

Eingetragen im Vereinsregister des Amtsgerichts Berlin-Charlottenburg
unter der Nummer 23855 Nz. Als gemeinnützig anerkannt durch das
Finanzamt für Körperschaften I Berlin, Steuernummer 27/681/51985.

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Helder .
In reply to this post by Yuri Astrakhan-2
On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 12:25 AM, Yuri Astrakhan
<[hidden email]>wrote:

> Of course - I am actually modeling this feature on Semantic MW. It's just
> that I doubt WMF will enable SMW on the cluster any time soon :)
>

That request was already WONTFIXed:
https://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=8390

Helder
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Bartosz Dziewoński
In reply to this post by Yuri Astrakhan-2
I have a vague feeling that a very similar proposal appeared on this very list a few months ago. (No links handy, though.)

--
Matma Rex

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Brian Wolff
On Jan 26, 2014 10:02 AM, "Bartosz Dziewoński" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> I have a vague feeling that a very similar proposal appeared on this very
list a few months ago. (No links handy, though.)
>
> --
> Matma Rex
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

Category intersection proposals seem to appear on this list about once
every 2 years as far as i remember. Usually they dont succede because
nobody ends up writing any efficient code to implement it.

-bawolff
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Gryllida
http://migadv.com/ comes to mind (https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IEG/MediaWiki_data_browser) but sadly it's barely interactive...

  gry

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Chad
In reply to this post by Lydia Pintscher
On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 1:10 AM, Lydia Pintscher <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 10:53 AM, Yuri Astrakhan
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
> >
> > #CATQUERY <query>
> >
> > magic keyword for the category pages.
> >
> > When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
> > against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
> > result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
> >
> > For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
> > quickly redefined as
> > a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
> >
> > #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
> >
> > Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate
> queries,
> > including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
>
> In the future this will be possible using Wikidata and queries. My
> dream is that categories will to a very large extend go away then and
> be replaced with better Wikidata-based tools. I'd _really_ like us not
> to introduce more incentives to use categories like this one. Also
> it'd be quite a source for confusion to have both.
>
>
Indeed. I think it would be very shortsighted to introduce any sort of new
syntax here for this right now as proposed.

There's lots of exciting query opportunities coming with Wikidata as Lydia
says (which will very likely end up using Elasticsearch in some manner).

On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 10:21 AM, Brian Wolff <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Category intersection proposals seem to appear on this list about once
> every 2 years as far as i remember. Usually they dont succede because
> nobody ends up writing any efficient code to implement it.
>

Yep, we've been here before. Because category intersection isn't easy with
the schema we've got. However, it's incredibly trivial to do in
Elasticsearch.
So I imagine if we invest more effort in helping Wikidata expand its syntax
and uses we'll likely end up with what Yuri's wanting--if maybe in a
different
form.

I'll also note we've already solved category intersection in Cirrus ;-)

https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?search=incategory%3A%221941+births%22+incategory%3A%221995+deaths%22&title=Special%3ASearch


-Chad
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Gerard Meijssen-3
Hoi,
In Reasonator we now support calendars [1] It does show you things like
people who were born / died on that date, events under way on that date ..

Play with and notice that longer periods are also supported. Some longer
periods may take some time but we have a waiting bar for you..It does
support any of the languages that we support. It uses Wikidata information
so if your favourite person or event is not mentioned. Just add the details
in Wikidata.
Thanks,
       GerardM

PS three cheers for Magnus


[1]


On 30 January 2014 19:50, Chad <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 1:10 AM, Lydia Pintscher <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > On Fri, Jan 24, 2014 at 10:53 AM, Yuri Astrakhan
> > <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
> > >
> > > #CATQUERY <query>
> > >
> > > magic keyword for the category pages.
> > >
> > > When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
> > > against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
> > > result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
> > >
> > > For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
> > > quickly redefined as
> > > a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
> > >
> > > #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
> > >
> > > Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate
> > queries,
> > > including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
> >
> > In the future this will be possible using Wikidata and queries. My
> > dream is that categories will to a very large extend go away then and
> > be replaced with better Wikidata-based tools. I'd _really_ like us not
> > to introduce more incentives to use categories like this one. Also
> > it'd be quite a source for confusion to have both.
> >
> >
> Indeed. I think it would be very shortsighted to introduce any sort of new
> syntax here for this right now as proposed.
>
> There's lots of exciting query opportunities coming with Wikidata as Lydia
> says (which will very likely end up using Elasticsearch in some manner).
>
> On Sun, Jan 26, 2014 at 10:21 AM, Brian Wolff <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > Category intersection proposals seem to appear on this list about once
> > every 2 years as far as i remember. Usually they dont succede because
> > nobody ends up writing any efficient code to implement it.
> >
>
> Yep, we've been here before. Because category intersection isn't easy with
> the schema we've got. However, it's incredibly trivial to do in
> Elasticsearch.
> So I imagine if we invest more effort in helping Wikidata expand its syntax
> and uses we'll likely end up with what Yuri's wanting--if maybe in a
> different
> form.
>
> I'll also note we've already solved category intersection in Cirrus ;-)
>
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?search=incategory%3A%221941+births%22+incategory%3A%221995+deaths%22&title=Special%3ASearch
>
>
> -Chad
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Dan Garry
In reply to this post by Yuri Astrakhan-2
Hey Yuri,

This is a really cool idea. It's almost like set theory for categories! You
can define certain base categories (based upon manually entering them into
the category using existing category syntax), then define other categories
based on set theoretic operations on categories. Certainly, if we could go
back in time and build categories from the ground up again, I think this
approach would be far superior.

This feature is sufficiently complex from a product standpoint that I think
the best thing to do here is to wait to see what happens with
CirrusSearch's integration with Wikidata. Many cool features like this may
end up being obsoleted by any effort for Wikidata integration. If not, we
can revisit this then.

Thanks,
Dan






On 24 January 2014 01:53, Yuri Astrakhan <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
>
> #CATQUERY <query>
>
> magic keyword for the category pages.
>
> When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
> against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
> result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
>
> For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
> quickly redefined as
> a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
>
> #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
>
> Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate queries,
> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l




--
Dan Garry
Associate Product Manager for Platform
Wikimedia Foundation
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Chad
In reply to this post by Chad
On Thu, Jan 30, 2014 at 10:50 AM, Chad <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'll also note we've already solved category intersection in Cirrus ;-)
>
>
> https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?search=incategory%3A%221941+births%22+incategory%3A%221995+deaths%22&title=Special%3ASearch
>
>
>
That should read "in both the old and new search" actually.

It just goes to show you how easy this is in lucene world.

-Chad
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Dynamic search results as category pages

Gerard Meijssen-3
In reply to this post by Yuri Astrakhan-2
Hoi,

With the "autolist" [1] and Widar you can make claims for the entries in a
category. So you can first claim "occupation" "philosopher" and then make
other claims about such philosophers ... Mind you claiming the Greek
nationality for people who spoke Greek is problematic when these people
were living before the creation of Greece. Possible claims are that they
spoke Greek ...
Thanks,
     GerardM

[1] http://tools.wmflabs.org/wikidata-todo/autolist.html#



On 24 January 2014 10:53, Yuri Astrakhan <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi, I am thinking of implementing a
>
> #CATQUERY <query>
>
> magic keyword for the category pages.
>
> When this keyword is present, the category page would execute a query
> against the search backend instead of normal category behavior and show
> result as if those pages were actually marked with this category.
>
> For example, this would allow Greek Philosophers category page to be
> quickly redefined as
> a cross-section of greeks & philosophers categories:
>
> #CATQUERY incategory:Greek incategory:Philosopher
>
> Obviously the community will be able to define much more elaborate queries,
> including the ordering (will be supported by the new search backend)
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l