Historical debates

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Historical debates

Molu Bosu Palit
Hi,
   
  A page has come up called [[Wikipedia:Historical debates]] that seeks
to record the major global disputes that have occurred at and
influenced wikipedia. It also contains a short exposition on the nature of these
disputes. What do you think?
   
  Molu
               
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Re: Historical debates

Fred Bauder
Better than relying on the memory of old timers.

Fred

On May 16, 2006, at 4:43 AM, Molu wrote:

> Hi,
>
>   A page has come up called [[Wikipedia:Historical debates]] that  
> seeks
> to record the major global disputes that have occurred at and
> influenced wikipedia. It also contains a short exposition on the  
> nature of these
> disputes. What do you think?
>
>   Molu
>
> ---------------------------------
> New Yahoo! Messenger with Voice. Call regular phones from your PC  
> and save big.
> _______________________________________________
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>

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Re: Historical debates

Charles Matthews
But isn't 'historic debates' more what is meant?  'Historical debates' might
mean debates relative to history topics; rather than debates which are now
mercifully history.

Charles


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Re: Historical debates

Guy Chapman aka JzG
On Tue, 16 May 2006 13:46:41 +0100, Charles Matthews wrote:

>But isn't 'historic debates' more what is meant?  'Historical debates' might
>mean debates relative to history topics; rather than debates which are now
>mercifully history.

"May, 2006: a debate between Charles Matthews and Fred Bauder on
whether historic or historical was the correct term for this list..."

Guy (JzG)
--
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http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:JzG

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Re: Historical debates

Steve Bennett-4
On 5/16/06, Guy Chapman aka JzG <[hidden email]> wrote:
> "May, 2006: a debate between Charles Matthews and Fred Bauder on
> whether historic or historical was the correct term for this list..."

Heh. Though I agree - "historical debates" to me would either be an
exhaustive list of all past debates, or a list of debates about
historical subjects. Historic means significant...

Steve
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Re: Historical debates

Molu Bosu Palit
In reply to this post by Molu Bosu Palit
Hello,
   
  In anticipation, the wise author of the page has appealed to the masses to keep the page off itself. Anyway, I've moved the page to Historic debates. Currently it lists the Cartoon controversy, Lolicon and Userbox. What else do you think is significant enough to be included?
   
  Molu


  On Tue, 16 May 2006 22:10:49 +0100, Guy Chapman aka JzG wrote:

>"May, 2006: a debate between Charles Matthews and Fred Bauder on
>whether historic or historical was the correct term for this list..."

>Guy (JzG)
               
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Re: Historical debates

Steve Bennett-4
On 5/17/06, Molu <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Hello,
>
>   In anticipation, the wise author of the page has appealed to the masses to keep the page off itself. Anyway, I've moved the page to Historic debates. Currently it lists the Cartoon controversy, Lolicon and Userbox. What else do you think is significant enough to be included?

Go to WP:LAME. It's always a good pick me up, and must be a rich
breeding ground. Jimbo's talk page history should give you some clues
too.

Steve
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Re: Historical debates

geni
In reply to this post by Molu Bosu Palit
On 5/17/06, Molu <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Hello,
>
>   In anticipation, the wise author of the page has appealed to the masses to keep the page off itself. Anyway, I've moved the page to Historic debates. Currently it lists the Cartoon controversy, Lolicon and Userbox. What else do you think is significant enough to be included?
>
>   Molu

As a start

Schools +the various other deletionist/inclusionist battles

Autofellatio

[[Wikipedia:Miscellaneous deletion/Wikipedia:WikiProject Wikipedians
for Decency]]

BC/BCE (BVE got ignored poor thing)

The traditional april fools battle


--
geni
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Re: Historical debates

Andrew Gray
In reply to this post by Molu Bosu Palit
On 17/05/06, Molu <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Hello,
>
>  In anticipation, the wise author of the page has appealed to the masses to keep the page off itself. Anyway, I've moved the page to Historic debates. Currently it lists the Cartoon controversy, Lolicon and Userbox. What else do you think is significant enough to be included?

The inclusion/exclusion debate over schools (2004/5?) was pretty
significant, and to a lesser extent the various ancillary notability
debates. (It also had some really annoying knock-on effects I wish
we'd seen at the time...)

--
- Andrew Gray
  [hidden email]
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Re: Historical debates

Alphax (Wikipedia email)
In reply to this post by Molu Bosu Palit
Molu wrote:
> Hello,
>
> In anticipation, the wise author of the page has appealed to the
> masses to keep the page off itself. Anyway, I've moved the page to
> Historic debates. Currently it lists the Cartoon controversy, Lolicon
> and Userbox. What else do you think is significant enough to be
> included?
>

Kate Winslet.

--
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Contributor to Wikipedia, the Free Encyclopedia
"We make the internet not suck" - Jimbo Wales
Public key: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Alphax/OpenPGP


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Re: Historical debates

Andrew Gray
In reply to this post by Andrew Gray
On 17/05/06, Andrew Gray <[hidden email]> wrote:

> The inclusion/exclusion debate over schools (2004/5?) was pretty
> significant, and to a lesser extent the various ancillary notability
> debates. (It also had some really annoying knock-on effects I wish
> we'd seen at the time...)

additionally - page titles in American vs. Commonwealth English or in
historic vs. current local name; why "Danzig/Gdansk" or
"petrol/gasoline" are now shorthand for nastiness.

--
- Andrew Gray
  [hidden email]
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Re: Historical debates

Joseph Reagle
In reply to this post by Molu Bosu Palit
On Tuesday 16 May 2006 06:43, Molu wrote:
> What do you think?

There would be some redundancies with:
  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Lamest_edit_wars_ever
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Re: Historical debates

Peter Mackay
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Joseph Reagle
>
> On Tuesday 16 May 2006 06:43, Molu wrote:
> > What do you think?
>
> There would be some redundancies with:
>   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Lamest_edit_wars_ever

Some of WP's greatest debates have been anything but lame, but yes, there
would be a bit of overlap.

I love [[WP:LAME]]. We can all learn something about not seeing the tree for
the leaves.

Pete, occasional contributor to the lameness


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Re: Historical debates

Alphax (Wikipedia email)
Peter Mackay wrote:

>> From: [hidden email]
>> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Joseph Reagle
>>
>> On Tuesday 16 May 2006 06:43, Molu wrote:
>>> What do you think?
>> There would be some redundancies with:
>>   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Lamest_edit_wars_ever
>
> Some of WP's greatest debates have been anything but lame, but yes, there
> would be a bit of overlap.
>
> I love [[WP:LAME]]. We can all learn something about not seeing the tree for
> the leaves.
>
> Pete, occasional contributor to the lameness
>
I suppose that includes questioning the copyright status of an image
based on your personal dislike of the uploader?

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Re: Historical debates

Ray Saintonge
In reply to this post by Peter Mackay
Peter Mackay wrote:

>Some of WP's greatest debates have been anything but lame, but yes, there
>would be a bit of overlap.
>
>I love [[WP:LAME]]. We can all learn something about not seeing the tree for
>the leaves.
>
>Pete, occasional contributor to the lameness
>
Or make a movie about it called "The Silence of the Lame". ;-)

Ec

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Re: Historical debates

Peter Mackay
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Ray Saintonge

> Peter Mackay wrote:
>
> >Some of WP's greatest debates have been anything but lame, but yes,
> >there would be a bit of overlap.
> >
> >I love [[WP:LAME]]. We can all learn something about not seeing the
> >tree for the leaves.
> >
> >Pete, occasional contributor to the lameness
> >
> Or make a movie about it called "The Silence of the Lame". ;-)

Heh. Lame title. I like it!

But an insightful one all the same - Wikipedia's lamest battles take place
in silence, broken only by the tip-tap of keybards, the vindictive click of
mouse buttons, and the slow, steady drip of bile.

--Pete, adding colour


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Re: Historical debates

Peter Mackay
In reply to this post by Alphax (Wikipedia email)
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Alphax
> (Wikipedia email)
>
> Peter Mackay wrote:
> >> From: [hidden email]
> >> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Joseph Reagle
> >>
> >> On Tuesday 16 May 2006 06:43, Molu wrote:
> >>> What do you think?
> >> There would be some redundancies with:
> >>   http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Lamest_edit_wars_ever
> >
> > Some of WP's greatest debates have been anything but lame, but yes,
> > there would be a bit of overlap.
> >
> > I love [[WP:LAME]]. We can all learn something about not seeing the
> > tree for the leaves.
> >
> > Pete, occasional contributor to the lameness
>
> I suppose that includes questioning the copyright status of
> an image based on your personal dislike of the uploader?

Nope. When I saw that image I was thinking of my own smiling photograph,
ripped off my used page by someone making bad faith assumptions about
copyright status.

Pete, ever cheerful


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Re: Historical debates

Anthony DiPierro
On 5/23/06, Peter Mackay <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Nope. When I saw that image I was thinking of my own smiling photograph,
> ripped off my used page by someone making bad faith assumptions about
> copyright status.
>
You probably took it too personal.  This same thing happened to a
board member.  Wikipedia has in many ways gone from one extreme
(having blatant copyright violations scattered throughout the articles
and no one willing to take them down) to the other (having public
domain or licensed images ripped off user pages and deleted simply
because the uploader didn't state the source fast enough).

That's not to say that you responded to it correctly.

Anthony
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Re: Historical debates

Peter Mackay
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Anthony DiPierro
>
> On 5/23/06, Peter Mackay <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Nope. When I saw that image I was thinking of my own smiling
> > photograph, ripped off my used page by someone making bad faith
> > assumptions about copyright status.
> >
> You probably took it too personal.

Given the identity of the person who removed it, no I don't think so. It
wasn't an impersonal administrative tidy-up. It was deliberately aimed at
me.

--Peter


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