How accurate is Special:Version

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How accurate is Special:Version

Yousef Ourabi-3
Happy Holidays everyone.

I'm going through: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Version -- and it
means that the version of mediawiki currently deployed is r28966, however
that commit was only yesterday by siebrand -- is that correct. Also is the
extension list fully up to date, ie if I download and install everything on
that page, and run mwdumper I should have an exact mirror of wikipedia?


Thanks,
Yousef
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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Schneelocke
2007/12/30, Yousef Ourabi <[hidden email]>:
> I'm going through: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Version -- and it
> means that the version of mediawiki currently deployed is r28966, however
> that commit was only yesterday by siebrand -- is that correct.

Yes, the Wikimedia sites generally follow the MediaWiki trunk pretty closely.

> Also is the
> extension list fully up to date, ie if I download and install everything on
> that page, and run mwdumper I should have an exact mirror of wikipedia?

The extension list is generated automatically based on the extensions
that are installed, so in theory, yes, but do keep in mind that
different Wikipedias (and other projects) will have different
extensions enabled.

--
schnee

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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Daniel Friesen
Also remember that 100% of all extensions add themselves to the list of
extensions. So it's possible for some custom extensions to exist which
are not listed on [[Special:Version]] of some wiki.

~Daniel Friesen(Dantman) of:
-The Gaiapedia (http://gaia.wikia.com)
-Wikia ACG on Wikia.com (http://wikia.com/wiki/Wikia_ACG)
-and Wiki-Tools.com (http://wiki-tools.com)

Schneelocke wrote:

> 2007/12/30, Yousef Ourabi <[hidden email]>:
>  
>> I'm going through: http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Special:Version -- and it
>> means that the version of mediawiki currently deployed is r28966, however
>> that commit was only yesterday by siebrand -- is that correct.
>>    
>
> Yes, the Wikimedia sites generally follow the MediaWiki trunk pretty closely.
>
>  
>> Also is the
>> extension list fully up to date, ie if I download and install everything on
>> that page, and run mwdumper I should have an exact mirror of wikipedia?
>>    
>
> The extension list is generated automatically based on the extensions
> that are installed, so in theory, yes, but do keep in mind that
> different Wikipedias (and other projects) will have different
> extensions enabled.
>
>  
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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Platonides
DanTMan wrote:
> Also remember that 100% of all extensions add themselves to the list of
> extensions. So it's possible for some custom extensions to exist which
> are not listed on [[Special:Version]] of some wiki.

Erm, Daniel meant that *NOT* all extensions add themselves there.
Extensions not listed are usually old (before they could be) and given
that extensions at wikimedia wikis are quite mantained i think you can
mostly rely on it.
Also, there're configuration options not listed on Special:Version, like
namespace names, programs for uploads (file, convert...), tidy (enabled
on wmf wikis)...
If you want to sneak into the wikis config, you can see an old version
of them at http://noc.wikimedia.org/conf/


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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Yousef Ourabi-3
Thanks for the info and the link. The header mentions that the Apache conf
is always up to date, but is the "Common Settings.php" file up to
date: "http://noc.wikimedia.org/conf/CommonSettings.php.html
"

I'm setting up a  local mirror on my desktop and I've got math and wikiheiro
working however there are problems with hierogliphic pages and the
Template:Navbox tags (see attached images).

Trying to figure out where I went wrong and what extension I need to enable
to get the same presentation as wikipedia.

http://yousefourabi.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/hiero.png
http://yousefourabi.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/navbox.png

Thanks,
Yousef




>
>
>
>
> On 12/30/07, Platonides <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > DanTMan wrote:
> > > Also remember that 100% of all extensions add themselves to the list
> > of
> > > extensions. So it's possible for some custom extensions to exist which
> > > are not listed on [[Special:Version]] of some wiki.
> >
> > Erm, Daniel meant that *NOT* all extensions add themselves there.
> > Extensions not listed are usually old (before they could be) and given
> > that extensions at wikimedia wikis are quite mantained i think you can
> > mostly rely on it.
> > Also, there're configuration options not listed on Special:Version, like
> > namespace names, programs for uploads (file, convert...), tidy (enabled
> > on wmf wikis)...
> > If you want to sneak into the wikis config, you can see an old version
> > of them at http://noc.wikimedia.org/conf/
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
>
>
>
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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

MinuteElectron
Yousef Ourabi wrote:

> Thanks for the info and the link. The header mentions that the Apache conf
> is always up to date, but is the "Common Settings.php" file up to
> date: "http://noc.wikimedia.org/conf/CommonSettings.php.html
> "
>
> I'm setting up a  local mirror on my desktop and I've got math and wikiheiro
> working however there are problems with hierogliphic pages and the
> Template:Navbox tags (see attached images).
>
> Trying to figure out where I went wrong and what extension I need to enable
> to get the same presentation as wikipedia.
>
> http://yousefourabi.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/hiero.png
> http://yousefourabi.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/navbox.png
>  
Have you installed HTMLTidy and enabled it within MediaWiki, it is an
essential ingredient in most of the even slightly advanced templates as
it allows mixing of wikitext and HTML tables (as well as a variety of
other things)?

MinuteElectron.


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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Yousef Ourabi-3
I have tidy installed and this in LocalSettings.php -- it makes no
difference.

$wgUseTidy = true;
$wgAlwaysUseTidy = true;
$wgTidyConf = $IP.'/includes/tidy.conf';




On 1/1/08, MinuteElectron <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Yousef Ourabi wrote:
> > Thanks for the info and the link. The header mentions that the Apache
> conf
> > is always up to date, but is the "Common Settings.php" file up to
> > date: "http://noc.wikimedia.org/conf/CommonSettings.php.html
> > "
> >
> > I'm setting up a  local mirror on my desktop and I've got math and
> wikiheiro
> > working however there are problems with hierogliphic pages and the
> > Template:Navbox tags (see attached images).
> >
> > Trying to figure out where I went wrong and what extension I need to
> enable
> > to get the same presentation as wikipedia.
> >
> > http://yousefourabi.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/hiero.png
> > http://yousefourabi.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/navbox.png
> >
> Have you installed HTMLTidy and enabled it within MediaWiki, it is an
> essential ingredient in most of the even slightly advanced templates as
> it allows mixing of wikitext and HTML tables (as well as a variety of
> other things)?
>
> MinuteElectron.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

MinuteElectron
Yousef Ourabi wrote:
> I have tidy installed and this in LocalSettings.php -- it makes no
> difference.
>
> $wgUseTidy = true;
> $wgAlwaysUseTidy = true;
> $wgTidyConf = $IP.'/includes/tidy.conf';
>  
I presume tidy is installed on your server, although have you checked this?

MinuteElectron.

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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Yousef Ourabi-3
yes very sure that tidy is installed.

which tidy => /usr/bin/tidy

file tidy => /usr/bin/tidy: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386, version
1 (SYSV), for GNU/Linux 2.6.8, dynamically linked (uses shared libs),
stripped

thanks,
Yousef


On 1/1/08, MinuteElectron <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> Yousef Ourabi wrote:
> > I have tidy installed and this in LocalSettings.php -- it makes no
> > difference.
> >
> > $wgUseTidy = true;
> > $wgAlwaysUseTidy = true;
> > $wgTidyConf = $IP.'/includes/tidy.conf';
> >
> I presume tidy is installed on your server, although have you checked
> this?
>
> MinuteElectron.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Daniel Friesen
In reply to this post by MinuteElectron
I wouldn't really say that.
My templates are quite advanced and more complex than the Wikipedia
ones, and I've never had to mix html and parserfunctions like that.
Personally, using html tables like that kinda disturbs me.

~Daniel Friesen(Dantman) of:
-The Gaiapedia (http://gaia.wikia.com)
-Wikia ACG on Wikia.com (http://wikia.com/wiki/Wikia_ACG)
-and Wiki-Tools.com (http://wiki-tools.com)

MinuteElectron wrote:

> Yousef Ourabi wrote:
>  
>> Thanks for the info and the link. The header mentions that the Apache conf
>> is always up to date, but is the "Common Settings.php" file up to
>> date: "http://noc.wikimedia.org/conf/CommonSettings.php.html
>> "
>>
>> I'm setting up a  local mirror on my desktop and I've got math and wikiheiro
>> working however there are problems with hierogliphic pages and the
>> Template:Navbox tags (see attached images).
>>
>> Trying to figure out where I went wrong and what extension I need to enable
>> to get the same presentation as wikipedia.
>>
>> http://yousefourabi.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/hiero.png
>> http://yousefourabi.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/01/navbox.png
>>  
>>    
> Have you installed HTMLTidy and enabled it within MediaWiki, it is an
> essential ingredient in most of the even slightly advanced templates as
> it allows mixing of wikitext and HTML tables (as well as a variety of
> other things)?
>
> MinuteElectron.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
>  

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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

MinuteElectron
DanTMan wrote:
> I wouldn't really say that.
> My templates are quite advanced and more complex than the Wikipedia
> ones, and I've never had to mix html and parserfunctions like that.
> Personally, using html tables like that kinda disturbs me.
>  
I was referring to the Wikipedia ones, they nearly all use some form of
HTML + wikitext mix or don't finish tables due to the fact that - more
often that not - the actually included templates are made up of hundreds
of smaller ones. You may well be able to create more complex templates
without doing this (so could many others), but we are talking about
Wikipedia here - not your bog standard wiki.

MinuteElectron.

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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Danny Joe Bauch
In reply to this post by Yousef Ourabi-3
I saw similar problems on my wiki until I rolled the parser back to
the 1.11version. I assumed that one issue is that I'm using a newer
version of PHP
than the one used on Wikipedia, and that I am running on Windows rather than
Linux. It also looks like Template:Navbox/core is missing from your wiki
database. Wikihiero is working for me, as are the new navbox templates. Tidy
settings did not impact the problem in my case.

On Jan 1, 2008 1:09 PM, Yousef Ourabi <[hidden email]> wrote:

> yes very sure that tidy is installed.
>
> which tidy => /usr/bin/tidy
>
> file tidy => /usr/bin/tidy: ELF 32-bit LSB executable, Intel 80386,
> version
> 1 (SYSV), for GNU/Linux 2.6.8, dynamically linked (uses shared libs),
> stripped
>
> thanks,
> Yousef
>
>
> On 1/1/08, MinuteElectron <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
>  > Yousef Ourabi wrote:
> > > I have tidy installed and this in LocalSettings.php -- it makes no
> > > difference.
> > >
> > > $wgUseTidy = true;
> > > $wgAlwaysUseTidy = true;
> > > $wgTidyConf = $IP.'/includes/tidy.conf';
> > >
> > I presume tidy is installed on your server, although have you checked
> > this?
> >
> > MinuteElectron.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

MinuteElectron
DJ Bauch wrote:
> I saw similar problems on my wiki until I rolled the parser back to
> the 1.11version
This could indeed be the problem - as far as I know the parser hasn't
been switched to the new one on the live Wikimedia sites yet so the
templates probably haven't been "translated" to work with the new
preprocessor. See the base of DefaultSettings.php for the variable to
alter in LocalSettings.php.

MinuteElectron.

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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Yousef Ourabi-3
DJ, thanks that gives me something to work on.

MinuteElectron: Is this change documented anywhere? Also the setting in
DefaultSettings, are you referring to $wgParserConf. It is a big file and
I'm not exactly sure what I'm looking for?

Thanks everyone.
Yousef

On 1/1/08, MinuteElectron <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> DJ Bauch wrote:
> > I saw similar problems on my wiki until I rolled the parser back to
> > the 1.11version
> This could indeed be the problem - as far as I know the parser hasn't
> been switched to the new one on the live Wikimedia sites yet so the
> templates probably haven't been "translated" to work with the new
> preprocessor. See the base of DefaultSettings.php for the variable to
> alter in LocalSettings.php.
>
> MinuteElectron.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

MinuteElectron
Yousef Ourabi wrote:
> DJ, thanks that gives me something to work on.
>
> MinuteElectron: Is this change documented anywhere? Also the setting in
> DefaultSettings, are you referring to $wgParserConf. It is a big file and
> I'm not exactly sure what I'm looking for?
>
> Thanks everyone.
> Yousef
You'll want to add:

$wgParserConf = array(
    'class' => 'Parser_OldPP',
);

to somewhere near the bottom of LocalSettings.php (anywhere below the
DefaultSettings.php include).

MinuteElectron.

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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Aryeh Gregor
In reply to this post by MinuteElectron
On 1/1/08, MinuteElectron <[hidden email]> wrote:
> DJ Bauch wrote:
> > I saw similar problems on my wiki until I rolled the parser back to
> > the 1.11version
> This could indeed be the problem - as far as I know the parser hasn't
> been switched to the new one on the live Wikimedia sites yet so the
> templates probably haven't been "translated" to work with the new
> preprocessor. See the base of DefaultSettings.php for the variable to
> alter in LocalSettings.php.

Hmm, why is the new parser the default one when it's not
production-ready yet?  I guess this is trunk, so we don't have to
worry *too* much about things not working, but "the trunk must work at
all times" doesn't seem to be followed here very well.

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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Yousef Ourabi-3
MinuteElectron: Thanks that did the trick for the garbled pages. I don't see
this referenced anywhere, is there something I can read to educate myself on
the differences?

DJ Bauch: However the Templates/Navbox is still not being processed. You say
"It also looks like Template:Navbox/core is missing from your wiki database"
however I did a successful setup from the revision that was running in
production. Does anyone have any suggestions on how I can repair this?

Thanks for help, I really appreciate it.
Yousef

On 1/1/08, Simetrical <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> On 1/1/08, MinuteElectron <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > DJ Bauch wrote:
> > > I saw similar problems on my wiki until I rolled the parser back to
> > > the 1.11version
> > This could indeed be the problem - as far as I know the parser hasn't
> > been switched to the new one on the live Wikimedia sites yet so the
> > templates probably haven't been "translated" to work with the new
> > preprocessor. See the base of DefaultSettings.php for the variable to
> > alter in LocalSettings.php.
>
> Hmm, why is the new parser the default one when it's not
> production-ready yet?  I guess this is trunk, so we don't have to
> worry *too* much about things not working, but "the trunk must work at
> all times" doesn't seem to be followed here very well.
>
> _______________________________________________
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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Aryeh Gregor
On 1/1/08, Yousef Ourabi <[hidden email]> wrote:
> MinuteElectron: Thanks that did the trick for the garbled pages. I don't see
> this referenced anywhere, is there something I can read to educate myself on
> the differences?

The appropriate reference somewhere is, "Don't run trunk on production
systems unless you know what you're doing and follow the technical
discussions."  Trunk is not guaranteed to work in an obvious fashion
(although usually it does, and it's a failure when it doesn't).

If you *had* followed the technical discussions since the release of
1.11, you would have seen the discussion over the new parser that Tim
built, and the fact that it was disabled for Wikipedia due to various
issues.  You could then have inferred that you might want to disable
it for your installation.  Issues like this aren't noted in the
release notes or anywhere else, because they're expected to be fixed
before release.

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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Mohamed Magdy-2
If a template doesn't work:
1-Check if you have all extensions needed.
2-Check that you have got all the needed templates and do the following:
a- open your specific template i.e.
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Template:Navbox&action=edit
b- look at the bottom of the page, you should see a list of  transclude
templates, copy/create all these templates on your wiki.
c- repeat step b for each template until you have filled all the
dependencies.
d- clear the cache.
e- if it doesn't work, check if you have a version close to the version
running on the wiki you are trying to clone.
f- if it doesn't work, then ask.

Thanks
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Re: How accurate is Special:Version

Domas Mituzas
In reply to this post by Yousef Ourabi-3
Special:Version is never accurate:

a) there may always be one or more livehacks, that get there because  
of.. live hacking (like profiling sections added here or there)
b) some changes to some files can happen sooner than the whole  
'update to trunk & sync' operation. small changes rarely go live as  
'scaps', as not everyone wants to review all trunk stuff.

but thats life, and we've got Brion to be the code maintainer :) hi  
Brion!

BR,
--
Domas Mituzas -- http://dammit.lt/ -- [[user:midom]]



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