Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
158 messages Options
12345 ... 8
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Erik Moeller-4
2009/8/25 Gregory Maxwell <[hidden email]>:
> Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Thanks Greg. Our official press release, as well as a Q&A on the grant
and Board appointment, can be found here:

http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/Omidyar_Network_Grant_August_2009

More importantly, please review the questions and answers page about the grant.

http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/Omidyar_Network_Grant_August_2009QA

The network here in Buenos Aires has been a bit flaky, so we haven't
been able to post this in a fully time-synchronized manner.
--
Erik Möller
Deputy Director, Wikimedia Foundation

Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate

_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Ziko van Dijk
In reply to this post by Thomas Dalton
> Not the advisory board, the real one.
>
> _

Oh! Even better.

Kind regards
Ziko



--
Ziko van Dijk
NL-Silvolde

_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Thomas Dalton
In reply to this post by Erik Moeller-4
2009/8/25 Erik Moeller <[hidden email]>:
> More importantly, please review the questions and answers page about the grant.
>
> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/Omidyar_Network_Grant_August_2009QA

How can you have a Q&A on a topic like this that doesn't even address
the matter than you have sold a seat on the board? Has the WMF
completely lost touch with the community? It should be obvious that
this is going to be a highly controversial decision and yet you can't
even get the basic announcement right and don't even try and answer
the obvious question the community is going to ask. This is
ridiculous.

_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Anthony-73
On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 5:41 PM, Thomas Dalton <[hidden email]>wrote:

> 2009/8/25 Erik Moeller <[hidden email]>:
> > More importantly, please review the questions and answers page about the
> grant.
> >
> >
> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/Omidyar_Network_Grant_August_2009QA
>
> How can you have a Q&A on a topic like this that doesn't even address
> the matter than you have sold a seat on the board?


I notice it doesn't address the matter that they have stopped beating their
wives, either.
_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Steven Walling
I think everyone needs to calm down a little.
Remember that we just got 2 million dollars to further our mission, and that
the board seat appointment (which isn't an unusual practice, at least in my
experience) does nothing to impede our work and the positive impact we can
have. It's the exact opposite, in fact.

Steven Walling

On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 2:43 PM, Anthony <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 5:41 PM, Thomas Dalton <[hidden email]
> >wrote:
>
> > 2009/8/25 Erik Moeller <[hidden email]>:
> > > More importantly, please review the questions and answers page about
> the
> > grant.
> > >
> > >
> >
> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/Omidyar_Network_Grant_August_2009QA
> >
> > How can you have a Q&A on a topic like this that doesn't even address
> > the matter than you have sold a seat on the board?
>
>
> I notice it doesn't address the matter that they have stopped beating their
> wives, either.
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>
_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Thomas Dalton
In reply to this post by Anthony-73
2009/8/25 Anthony <[hidden email]>:

> On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 5:41 PM, Thomas Dalton <[hidden email]>wrote:
>
>> 2009/8/25 Erik Moeller <[hidden email]>:
>> > More importantly, please review the questions and answers page about the
>> grant.
>> >
>> >
>> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/Omidyar_Network_Grant_August_2009QA
>>
>> How can you have a Q&A on a topic like this that doesn't even address
>> the matter than you have sold a seat on the board?
>
>
> I notice it doesn't address the matter that they have stopped beating their
> wives, either.

Someone gives $2m to the WMF and gets a seat on the board on the same
day. I think I can conclude, beyond reasonable doubt, that those are
not unrelated events.

_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Thomas Dalton
In reply to this post by Steven Walling
2009/8/25 Steven Walling <[hidden email]>:
> I think everyone needs to calm down a little.
> Remember that we just got 2 million dollars to further our mission, and that
> the board seat appointment (which isn't an unusual practice, at least in my
> experience) does nothing to impede our work and the positive impact we can
> have. It's the exact opposite, in fact.

It is not unusual for many charities. It is unusual for a community
driven charity like the WMF.

_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Nathan Awrich
In reply to this post by Anthony-73
Thanks, Erik and Jan-Bart, for the additional information and the Q & A.
Appointing board members from donor organizations can be tricksy,
particularly as the relationships in question evolve. Hopefully it goes
smoothly.
On the reporting requirements built into the grant - will the information
reported to the Omidyar Network be reported to the community as well? I
think we'd all be interested to read updates on those topics.

Nathan
_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Gregory Maxwell
In reply to this post by Steven Walling
On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 5:47 PM, Steven Walling<[hidden email]> wrote:
> I think everyone needs to calm down a little.
> Remember that we just got 2 million dollars to further our mission, and that
> the board seat appointment (which isn't an unusual practice, at least in my
> experience) does nothing to impede our work and the positive impact we can
> have. It's the exact opposite, in fact.

Indeed. Per the FAQ — it's a $2m unrestricted grant paid out in four chunks.

Grants that big without specific targeted goals are somewhat unusual.
Arguably the imposition of goals has a lot more influence on the
operation of an origination than a simple board seat, even if it's a
voting seat.

_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Anthony-73
In reply to this post by Thomas Dalton
On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 5:48 PM, Thomas Dalton <[hidden email]>wrote:

> 2009/8/25 Anthony <[hidden email]>:
> > On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 5:41 PM, Thomas Dalton <[hidden email]
> >wrote:
> >
> >> 2009/8/25 Erik Moeller <[hidden email]>:
> >> > More importantly, please review the questions and answers page about
> the
> >> grant.
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/Omidyar_Network_Grant_August_2009QA
> >>
> >> How can you have a Q&A on a topic like this that doesn't even address
> >> the matter than you have sold a seat on the board?
> >
> >
> > I notice it doesn't address the matter that they have stopped beating
> their
> > wives, either.
>
> Someone gives $2m to the WMF and gets a seat on the board on the same
> day. I think I can conclude, beyond reasonable doubt, that those are
> not unrelated events.


Occurring on the same day may imply "related" but it does not, beyond a
reasonable doubt, equal "sold".  If it did, we'd have a whole lot more
prostitution convictions.
_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Thomas Dalton
2009/8/25 Anthony <[hidden email]>:
> Occurring on the same day may imply "related" but it does not, beyond a
> reasonable doubt, equal "sold".  If it did, we'd have a whole lot more
> prostitution convictions.

As I've already said, whether or not it was sold is irrelevant, it
*looks* like it was sold, and that is a big problem.

_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Anthony-73
On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 6:01 PM, Thomas Dalton <[hidden email]>wrote:

> 2009/8/25 Anthony <[hidden email]>:
> > Occurring on the same day may imply "related" but it does not, beyond a
> > reasonable doubt, equal "sold".  If it did, we'd have a whole lot more
> > prostitution convictions.
>
> As I've already said, whether or not it was sold is irrelevant, it
> *looks* like it was sold, and that is a big problem.


"How can you have a Q&A on a topic like this that doesn't even address the
matter than you have sold a seat on the board?"

That's the comment I was referring to with my wife beating statement.

Anyway, I'd be much more concerned if the money had gone not to the
foundation, but to a board member's for-profit corporation.  Even if it is
quid-pro-quo, so what?  This ain't a community run foundation, people.

On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 6:02 PM, Gregory Maxwell <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 5:59 PM, Anthony<[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Occurring on the same day may imply "related" but it does not, beyond a
> > reasonable doubt, equal "sold".  If it did, we'd have a whole lot more
> > prostitution convictions.
>
> ... it could be reliably determined, but I don't think anyone is going
> to give Kohs 2million dollars to spend on a seat.


 You really think they'd give it to him?
_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Michael Snow-3
In reply to this post by Gregory Maxwell
Gregory Maxwell wrote:

> On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 5:47 PM, Steven Walling<[hidden email]> wrote:
>  
>> I think everyone needs to calm down a little.
>> Remember that we just got 2 million dollars to further our mission, and that
>> the board seat appointment (which isn't an unusual practice, at least in my
>> experience) does nothing to impede our work and the positive impact we can
>> have. It's the exact opposite, in fact.
>>    
> Indeed. Per the FAQ — it's a $2m unrestricted grant paid out in four chunks.
>
> Grants that big without specific targeted goals are somewhat unusual.
> Arguably the imposition of goals has a lot more influence on the
> operation of an origination than a simple board seat, even if it's a
> voting seat.
As Gregory points out, it's fairly unusual for foundations to make
grants of unrestricted money, and we've been quite fortunate to have
those as we develop our capacity to carry out the sorts of projects that
they will provide restricted grants for (like the usability initiative).
The Omidyar Network, in addition to making grants, likes to make itself
available as a resource for grantees, rather than simply handing out
money and then disappearing. For one example, their human resources
executive, also someone with experience as an eBay executive in that
area, could be a big help for us as we tackle hiring key positions such
as a CTO. And in a similar fashion we feel that Matt can be a resource
for us as a board member. He has extensive experience in strategic
planning processes, at eBay and previously in his consulting work, and
also has important nonprofit experience, serving on the boards of
organizations like DonorsChoose.org and the Sunlight Foundation.

As I mentioned earlier, Jay was going to publish the press releases and
Q&A, but as Erik explained we had some internet problems, so that's why
some of this was passed through via the external version of the press
release. I had also intended to write an additional note to the list
about the grant, but lost my internet connection immediately after I
sent the first one. The information is all posted on the foundation
website now that we have connectivity again:
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/Omidyar_Network_Grant_August_2009
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/Omidyar_Network_Grant_August_2009QA
http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Press_releases/Board_Announcements_August_2009

--Michael Snow


_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Sue Gardner-2
In reply to this post by Nathan Awrich
Sorry to top-post (Blackberry).

Yes, the progress towards the goals will be published to the
community.  Omidyar wants to support us in doing our work, so we
worked together to define what success will look like (as per the Q
and A). Those were very good conversations, in which they essentially
agreed with us on what's important -- overall global reach, overall
global participation, the importance of a broad base of donors
supporting our work, and the successful completion of the strategy
project. That is all good: it's stuff we care about, and would track
and report on anyway. It's a completely unrestricted grant, supporting
our own goals and priorities.

My apologies for the way this information reached you all. (I'm not
criticizing Greg: forwarding the press release was the obvious and
right thing for him to do.)  I'm just sorry that the detailed
information didn't reach foundation-l from the Wikimedia Foundation
itself, first.  Suffice to say that connectivity at both the venue and
hotel has been super-patchy today, and was unexpectedly down all
afternoon :-(

Thanks,
Sue

On 25/08/2009, Nathan <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Thanks, Erik and Jan-Bart, for the additional information and the Q & A.
> Appointing board members from donor organizations can be tricksy,
> particularly as the relationships in question evolve. Hopefully it goes
> smoothly.
> On the reporting requirements built into the grant - will the information
> reported to the Omidyar Network be reported to the community as well? I
> think we'd all be interested to read updates on those topics.
>
> Nathan
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>


--
Sue Gardner
Executive Director
Wikimedia Foundation

415 839 6885 office
415 816 9967 cell

Imagine a world in which every single human being can freely share in
the sum of all knowledge.  Help us make it a reality!

http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate

_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Anthony-73
In reply to this post by Anthony-73
On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 5:59 PM, Anthony <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Occurring on the same day may imply "related" but it does not, beyond a
> reasonable doubt, equal "sold".  If it did, we'd have a whole lot more
> prostitution convictions.
>

Nevermind:
http://www.reuters.com/article/pressRelease/idUS157391+18-Mar-2009+PRN20090318

I'm tempted to continue my "prostitution" analogy, but I won't.
_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

thekohser
In reply to this post by Gregory Maxwell
Anthony said:

*>> Wales was right when he said that the
*>>* community* *is irrelevant.
*

James Forrester then made a humorous attempt to deflect the possibility that
this might possibly be true.

James, you may benefit from reading (with an open mind, if possible) the
following essay from attorney Alex Roshuk:

http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=User:Alex756&oldid=105080989

That might give you a clue as to the tack that Anthony was talking about.

--
Gregory Kohs
_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

thekohser
In reply to this post by Gregory Maxwell
*Jan-Bart de Vreede said:
*
"the next year will be crucial for us as an

organization in determining our long term strategy. But that process
is shaped by YOU. The tremendous strategy project (details at
http://strategy.wikimedia.org
  ) started a month ago is making good first steps. The Board of
Trustees does not own any of the Wikimedia projects, you do.
Participate on the strategy wiki (and encourage others to do so) to
help determine the future direction of our organization, you will
probably have more impace than any single board member ever will..."

++++++++

I offered a proposal at the Wikimedia Strategy project, with supporting
links to outside, independent documentation.  Within about 40 minutes, the
proposal was removed, and I was indefinitely blocked from that particular
project, including IP address blocking.   This, despite the fact that I
almost single-handedly wrote the sampling design and fine-tuned literally
all of the 2009 Foundation Development Survey for the WMF on the Meta
project.

But, I "own" the Wikimedia projects?  I will have more impact by being
blocked from the Wikimedia Strategy project than any single board member
(including Jimmy Wales?) ever will?

Your pithy inspirational motivations are ringing hollow for me, Mr. de
Vreede.

--
Gregory Kohs
_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

George William Herbert
On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 6:08 PM, Gregory Kohs<[hidden email]> wrote:

> *Jan-Bart de Vreede said:
> *
> "the next year will be crucial for us as an
>
> organization in determining our long term strategy. But that process
> is shaped by YOU. The tremendous strategy project (details at
> http://strategy.wikimedia.org
>  ) started a month ago is making good first steps. The Board of
> Trustees does not own any of the Wikimedia projects, you do.
> Participate on the strategy wiki (and encourage others to do so) to
> help determine the future direction of our organization, you will
> probably have more impace than any single board member ever will..."
>
> ++++++++
>
> I offered a proposal at the Wikimedia Strategy project, with supporting
> links to outside, independent documentation.  Within about 40 minutes, the
> proposal was removed, and I was indefinitely blocked from that particular
> project, including IP address blocking.   This, despite the fact that I
> almost single-handedly wrote the sampling design and fine-tuned literally
> all of the 2009 Foundation Development Survey for the WMF on the Meta
> project.
>
> But, I "own" the Wikimedia projects?  I will have more impact by being
> blocked from the Wikimedia Strategy project than any single board member
> (including Jimmy Wales?) ever will?
>
> Your pithy inspirational motivations are ringing hollow for me, Mr. de
> Vreede.

Stepping sideways from the poking at each other...

As I'm not an administrator on the strategy project wiki, I can't see
what got deleted there.  Can you summarize it for us (or at least, for
me, in private email, if you don't want to send to the foundation
list)?

Thank you.


--
-george william herbert
[hidden email]

_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Erik Moeller-4
In reply to this post by Thomas Dalton
2009/8/25 Thomas Dalton <[hidden email]>:
> How can you have a Q&A on a topic like this that doesn't even address
> the matter than you have sold a seat on the board? Has the WMF
> completely lost touch with the community? It should be obvious that
> this is going to be a highly controversial decision and yet you can't
> even get the basic announcement right and don't even try and answer
> the obvious question the community is going to ask.

(begin quote)

Why did the Wikimedia Foundation invite Matt Halprin to join its Board?

Matt's background and skills are a great fit for the Wikimedia
Foundation Board of Trustees, which has had two "expertise"
(non-community) seats vacant since last April. Matt is a Board member
of several other non-profit organizations, which means he will bring
general non-profit governance and oversight experience to Wikimedia.
His background at eBay gives him a good understanding of issues
related to online community, trust, reputation, privacy and content
quality: all key issues for the Wikimedia Foundation. Matt also has a
background in strategy development, which will be useful for the
Wikimedia Foundation as it embarks on its collaborative strategy
development project. The Wikimedia Foundation believes Matt will be a
terrific addition to Wikimedia's Board of Trustees.

Is Matt Halprin's Board seat an individual seat, or an Omidyar Network seat?

Like all Wikimedia Board members, Matt will be a member as an
individual, not as a representative of any particular organization or
constituency. All Wikimedia Foundation Board members have an
obligation to put the best interests of the Wikimedia Foundation
first, and to do their best to support and guide the organization, to
help it achieve its mission and goals. The Wikimedia Foundation looks
forward to Matt's participation on the Board.

(end quote)

ON has supported many other charitable organizations in our space,
including Creative Commons and the Sunlight Foundation (which you
should look up if you don't know them - they're doing amazing work).
Having one of their most qualified staffers join our Board of Trustees
is a wonderful thing. Good Board members who bring the required
governance experience and the significant time and patience it takes,
particularly in our organization, to serve this role well, are hard to
find. Naturally, the Board has done its due diligence in reviewing
Matt as a candidate for the Board. Sue, Sara and I have also had deep
discussions about our values and objectives with him. I'm very pleased
to see him join our Board of Trustees; he's an excellent addition for
the expertise seats.

ON's long-time interest in wikis is not a conflict of interest, it's a
harmony of interests and expertise. If you look at ON's history,
you'll find that they've made some very early attempts to decentralize
and open up the grant-making process. It's reformed itself a couple of
times in the process, and the folks there are really thoughtful and
smart about open, collaborative projects. Our relationship with them
is not an accident, and we've started building it very early when we
moved to San Francisco. I'm hopeful that we can build a strong,
successful long-term relationship with them, as it makes obvious sense
to do so. I'm very pleased to see WMF be bold rather than timid in
breaking new ground and building new relationships like this, which
will be essential to break patterns of stagnation and re-ignite
Wikimedia's mission.
--
Erik Möller
Deputy Director, Wikimedia Foundation

Support Free Knowledge: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Donate

_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Omidyar Network Commits $2 Million Grant to Wikimedia Foundation

Jimmy Wales-3
In reply to this post by James Forrester-5
Thank you James.

Some bizarre claims are simply not worthy of serious response.  For the
record, the community is far from irrelevant: the community is the most
important thing, full stop.

James Forrester wrote:

> 2009/8/25 Anthony <[hidden email]>:
>> On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 4:42 PM, Thomas Dalton <[hidden email]>wrote:
>>>> membership organizations.  Wales was right when he said that the
>>> community
>>>> is irrelevant.
>>> When did Jimmy say that? I rather suspect you are taking something he
>>> said out of context...
>> Many years ago, but my source is confidential.
>
> I've heard that you frequently post claims that you fail to back up,
> but my source is confidential.
>
> Please.
>
> Oh, and someone told me to do this, but unfortunately I'm not allowed
> to say who instructed me so to do.
>
> James.


_______________________________________________
foundation-l mailing list
[hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
12345 ... 8