Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
 
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Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006? If we need another face to face meeting, the Royal Oak is free on Sunday, 29th January. The Royal Oak, 44, Tabard Street, London SE1 4JU - near Borough Tube station, short walk from London Bridge. Same model as before. Informal gathering from 12 noon. Meeting starts formally upstairs from 2pm (14:00 UTC). I have not booked the room, but it is free all day (when I checked the Landlord last night). Please let me know if I should book it! Cheers, -- Gordo (aka LoopZilla) [hidden email] http://pobox.com/~gordo/ http://www.loopzilla.org/ _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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On Sun, 22 Jan 2006, Gordon Joly wrote:
> > Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006? > > If we need another face to face meeting, the Royal Oak is free on Sunday, > 29th January. The Royal Oak, 44, Tabard Street, London SE1 4JU - near Borough > Tube station, short walk from London Bridge. > > Same model as before. Informal gathering from 12 noon. Meeting starts > formally upstairs from 2pm (14:00 UTC). > > I have not booked the room, but it is free all day (when I checked the > Landlord last night). > > Please let me know if I should book it! > > Cheers, > I can make it if it is happening. Chris -- Chris 'Awkward' McKenna [hidden email] www.sucs.org/~cmckenna The essential things in life are seen not with the eyes, but with the heart Antoine de Saint Exupery _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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At 12:59 +0000 22/1/06, Chris McKenna wrote:
>On Sun, 22 Jan 2006, Gordon Joly wrote: > >> >>Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006? >> >>If we need another face to face meeting, the Royal Oak is free on >>Sunday, 29th January. The Royal Oak, 44, Tabard Street, London SE1 >>4JU - near Borough Tube station, short walk from London Bridge. >> >>Same model as before. Informal gathering from 12 noon. Meeting >>starts formally upstairs from 2pm (14:00 UTC). >> >>I have not booked the room, but it is free all day (when I checked >>the Landlord last night). >> >>Please let me know if I should book it! >> >>Cheers, >> > >I can make it if it is happening. > >Chris > Excellent. Given the activity on this email list, there should be enough to keep us busy from 2pm to 6pm when we get get kicked out of the pub! :-) But we may have to wait on James getting back to us with responses from 1) The Wikimedia Foundation 2) Diane Cabell, who is casting a legal eye over the current version of our documents. -- Gordo (aka LoopZilla) [hidden email] http://pobox.com/~gordo/ http://www.loopzilla.org/ _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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In reply to this post by Gordon Joly
On 1/22/06, Gordon Joly <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006? > I'm think I could make this. I'd also be happy to talk about non-legal issues, as Jon already mentioned. It seems that incorporation is premature, though - is there a real need to meet face to face or would an online meeting be enough? (I'm travelling the next day as well, so..) Cormac _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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At 16:59 +0000 22/1/06, Cormac Lawler wrote:
>On 1/22/06, Gordon Joly <[hidden email]> wrote: >> >> Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006? > > > >I'm think I could make this. I'd also be happy to talk about non-legal >issues, as Jon already mentioned. It seems that incorporation is >premature, though - is there a real need to meet face to face or would >an online meeting be enough? (I'm travelling the next day as well, >so..) > >Cormac It could be online, if James decided so. He really does hold the lines of communication, both to the Foundation and our legal advice. -- [hidden email] Gordon Joly 116, Hind Grove London E14 6HP 020 7515 4964 07904 769 096 FAX: 08701 363 851 _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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In reply to this post by Cormac Lawler
On 1/22/06, Gordon Joly <[hidden email]> wrote:
> At 16:59 +0000 22/1/06, Cormac Lawler wrote: > >On 1/22/06, Gordon Joly <[hidden email]> wrote: > >> > >> Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006? > > > > > > >I'm think I could make this. I'd also be happy to talk about non-legal > >issues, as Jon already mentioned. It seems that incorporation is > >premature, though - is there a real need to meet face to face or would > >an online meeting be enough? (I'm travelling the next day as well, > >so..) > > > >Cormac > > > It could be online, if James decided so. He really does hold the > lines of communication, both to the Foundation and our legal advice. > I can make a meeting in London on the 28th or 29th (but not the following weekend. My feeling is that we could incorporate next weekend if we have had the legal review and the foundation board and their lawyers have not found any problems. The bylaws should not be in the MoA or AoA as we would like to be able to change them at a later date - but I will post about this separately. Andrew _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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> > >> Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006?
Are we going to have a meeting this weekend? I'm in London at the moment, so i can make it. It seems we have more people available for Sunday, so will we just say that date? Even if we can't incorporate (it seems this is impossible, with all the variables), we could talk about possible projects, and what not. Or what do people think? Cormac _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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On Thu, 26 Jan 2006, Cormac Lawler wrote:
>>>>> Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006? > > > Are we going to have a meeting this weekend? I'm in London at the > moment, so i can make it. It seems we have more people available for > Sunday, so will we just say that date? Even if we can't incorporate > (it seems this is impossible, with all the variables), we could talk > about possible projects, and what not. Or what do people think? > > Cormac I don't really think its worth having another meeting in advance of incorporation unless there are things we need to discuss re the incorporation or we need to physically sign something. As I understand the current state of play regarding possible projects we're still at the stage of tossing ideas into the ring to sound out the feasability of them. If this is the case then I suggest this is probably best done on IRC where people have access to the net so they can look up things and get quick asnwers rather than having to write it down for later. If we are going to have a meeting in person in London this Sunday then I need to know by tomorrow (friday) evening at the latest. Chris -- Chris 'Awkward' McKenna [hidden email] www.sucs.org/~cmckenna The essential things in life are seen not with the eyes, but with the heart Antoine de Saint Exupery _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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On 1/26/06, Chris McKenna <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Jan 2006, Cormac Lawler wrote: > > >>>>> Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006? > > > > > > Are we going to have a meeting this weekend? I'm in London at the > > moment, so i can make it. It seems we have more people available for > > Sunday, so will we just say that date? Even if we can't incorporate > > (it seems this is impossible, with all the variables), we could talk > > about possible projects, and what not. Or what do people think? > > > > Cormac > > I don't really think its worth having another meeting in advance of > incorporation unless there are things we need to discuss re the > incorporation or we need to physically sign something. > > As I understand the current state of play regarding possible projects > we're still at the stage of tossing ideas into the ring to sound out the > feasability of them. If this is the case then I suggest this is probably > best done on IRC where people have access to the net so they can look up > things and get quick asnwers rather than having to write it down for > later. > > If we are going to have a meeting in person in London this Sunday then I > need to know by tomorrow (friday) evening at the latest. > > Chris > One advantage of having meetings online is to include people who haven't been able to make it to London so far - including Delphine, Florence and Angela. I'm still happy to meet face to face this weekend, purely because I'm_in_London! But if there's not much interest, there's no point. So, who's still interested_and_available? Cormac _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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In reply to this post by Chris McKenna
On 1/26/06, Chris McKenna <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Jan 2006, Cormac Lawler wrote: > > >>>>> Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006? > > > > > > Are we going to have a meeting this weekend? I'm in London at the > > moment, so i can make it. It seems we have more people available for > > Sunday, so will we just say that date? Even if we can't incorporate > > (it seems this is impossible, with all the variables), we could talk > > about possible projects, and what not. Or what do people think? > > > > Cormac > > I don't really think its worth having another meeting in advance of > incorporation unless there are things we need to discuss re the > incorporation or we need to physically sign something. > > As I understand the current state of play regarding possible projects > we're still at the stage of tossing ideas into the ring to sound out the > feasability of them. If this is the case then I suggest this is probably > best done on IRC where people have access to the net so they can look up > things and get quick asnwers rather than having to write it down for > later. > > If we are going to have a meeting in person in London this Sunday then I > need to know by tomorrow (friday) evening at the latest. > > Chris > > -- > Chris 'Awkward' McKenna > I guess we need to know if we can incorporate on Sunday. I think all we need for this is an ok from the Board and positive comments from our legal adviser. I see no problem incorporating before we have hammered out every last detail of our future relationship with the foundation - we know we will be a chapter of some kind and I don't think we need to have agreed a contract before we incorporate. If there is to be a meeting, I'll be in London anyway on Sunday, so that will not be a problem - however I'll be away from my email from Friday afternoon onwards, so an early decision would be appreciated. Andrew _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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In reply to this post by Cormac Lawler
On Thu, 26 Jan 2006, Cormac Lawler wrote:
> > One advantage of having meetings online is to include people who > haven't been able to make it to London so far - including Delphine, > Florence and Angela. I'm still happy to meet face to face this > weekend, purely because I'm_in_London! But if there's not much > interest, there's no point. So, who's still interested_and_available? Ah, I'm not in London and haven't the time or money to shell out £30-35 every week on getting there. I can come when needed - as long as it isn't every week! Chris -- Chris 'Awkward' McKenna [hidden email] www.sucs.org/~cmckenna The essential things in life are seen not with the eyes, but with the heart Antoine de Saint Exupery _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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On 1/26/06, Chris McKenna <[hidden email]> wrote:
> On Thu, 26 Jan 2006, Cormac Lawler wrote: > > > > One advantage of having meetings online is to include people who > > haven't been able to make it to London so far - including Delphine, > > Florence and Angela. I'm still happy to meet face to face this > > weekend, purely because I'm_in_London! But if there's not much > > interest, there's no point. So, who's still interested_and_available? > > Ah, I'm not in London and haven't the time or money to shell out £30-35 > every week on getting there. I can come when needed - as long as it isn't > every week! > > Chris > Oh no, but that's what I mean! I live in Manchester, and it's also a bit of a hassle for me to get down to London, but it just so happens that I'm in London this weekend anyway (and a stone's throw from the Royal Oak). Cormac _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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On Thu, 26 Jan 2006, Cormac Lawler wrote:
> On 1/26/06, Chris McKenna <[hidden email]> wrote: >> On Thu, 26 Jan 2006, Cormac Lawler wrote: >>> >>> One advantage of having meetings online is to include people who >>> haven't been able to make it to London so far - including Delphine, >>> Florence and Angela. I'm still happy to meet face to face this >>> weekend, purely because I'm_in_London! But if there's not much >>> interest, there's no point. So, who's still interested_and_available? >> >> Ah, I'm not in London and haven't the time or money to shell out £30-35 >> every week on getting there. I can come when needed - as long as it isn't >> every week! >> >> Chris >> > > Oh no, but that's what I mean! I live in Manchester, and it's also a > bit of a hassle for me to get down to London, but it just so happens > that I'm in London this weekend anyway (and a stone's throw from the > Royal Oak). > > Cormac Chris -- Chris 'Awkward' McKenna [hidden email] www.sucs.org/~cmckenna The essential things in life are seen not with the eyes, but with the heart Antoine de Saint Exupery _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
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In reply to this post by Andrew Walker-3
On 1/27/06, Andrew Walker <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I guess we need to know if we can incorporate on Sunday. I think all > we need for this is an ok from the Board and positive comments from > our legal adviser. I see no problem incorporating before we have > hammered out every last detail of our future relationship with the > foundation - we know we will be a chapter of some kind and I don't > think we need to have agreed a contract before we incorporate. Getting any official answer from the whole Board before Sunday is unlikely. Are the documents you want the Board to ok really out of draft now? It would be pointless for us to be approving them if they're not ready, and although not every detail needs to be hammered out before you incorporate, it would make it much resolve any remaining issues now rather than later. Unless there's some reason for urgency, I'd suggest waiting until everything is finalised and can be approved by Delphine and ok'd by an actual Board resolution. Angela. _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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In reply to this post by Andrew Walker-3
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1 Andrew Walker wrote: > I guess we need to know if we can incorporate on Sunday. I think that it is premature, really; we still have to finally confirm the changes, and also wait for Board approval. I would be happy to have an IRC meeting this weekend, however, if people feel that it would be necessary. Yours sincerely, - -- James D. Forrester Wikimedia : [[W:en:User:Jdforrester|James F.]] E-Mail : [hidden email] IM (MSN) : [hidden email] -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.2 (MingW32) Comment: Using GnuPG with Mozilla - http://enigmail.mozdev.org iD8DBQFD2VTtd7WnstdBQBkRAtyYAJ9XJCD4qKJ4/RRE2foVoTchTI5JjwCfQoXP 5Komtr4YkRQ94MI4tfnDwP4= =0nt3 -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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>> I guess we need to know if we can incorporate on Sunday.
> > I think that it is premature, really; we still have to finally confirm > the changes, and also wait for Board approval. I would be happy to have > an IRC meeting this weekend, however, if people feel that it would be > necessary. Whilst I can certainly understand why people are raising some questions on how the *Chapter* will work, the *Company* (which forms the basis of the Charity) is subject to UK law and, as such, has to place that framework first. It is also the case that we cannot start on the Charity registration process (ie. start raising money to do "good works") until the Company completes the registration process, and it will take time. I am aware that a number of people have felt that we are slightly 'dragging our feet' on this; that there is a level of navel contemplation going on and a surprise that the forms haven't been submitted yet (ie. still). In respect of the company formation it is my belief that we probably *are* in a position to process the paperwork and proceed, and those signatures on the requisite forms and endpages are easiest done with everyone in the same place at the same time, indeed the pages before the final page can actually be amended before the whole set of papers are submitted (not that one should plan to do such a thing, of course, but it is an option). IMHO there is a separation between the operation of the Company/Charity (with its separate legal identity, concerned with raising money, etc) and the Chapter (probably more concerned with liaison between and support of editors) although they may be two faces of the same organisation in practice. IRC meetings are very suitable for the latter, face2face for the former. Alison _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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On 1/26/06, Alison Wheeler <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> I guess we need to know if we can incorporate on Sunday. > > > > I think that it is premature, really; we still have to finally confirm > > the changes, and also wait for Board approval. I would be happy to have > > an IRC meeting this weekend, however, if people feel that it would be > > necessary. > > Whilst I can certainly understand why people are raising some questions on > how the *Chapter* will work, the *Company* (which forms the basis of the > Charity) is subject to UK law and, as such, has to place that framework > first. It is also the case that we cannot start on the Charity > registration process (ie. start raising money to do "good works") until > the Company completes the registration process, and it will take time. Out of interest, how long do the processes of incorporation as a company and registration as a charity take? I guess the first formal board meeting will take place between incorporation and registration? > I am aware that a number of people have felt that we are slightly > 'dragging our feet' on this; that there is a level of navel contemplation > going on and a surprise that the forms haven't been submitted yet (ie. > still). In respect of the company formation it is my belief that we > probably *are* in a position to process the paperwork and proceed, and > those signatures on the requisite forms and endpages are easiest done with > everyone in the same place at the same time, indeed the pages before the > final page can actually be amended before the whole set of papers are > submitted (not that one should plan to do such a thing, of course, but it > is an option). Do you think the MoA and AoA are ok as they stand or are you anticipating a positive the legal review? > IMHO there is a separation between the operation of the Company/Charity > (with its separate legal identity, concerned with raising money, etc) and > the Chapter (probably more concerned with liaison between and support of > editors) although they may be two faces of the same organisation in > practice. IRC meetings are very suitable for the latter, face2face for the > former. I completely agree with you on this one. It may be that the strict relationship between the company/charity and the chapter will change with time - it may be sensible to start out with all members of the company being the chapter and changing this to a subset of the company members and assorted others being the chapter which could be "managed" by the company in some way. This is one reason (but not the only one) why the documents forming the company do not talk about a chapter - or indeed about wiki*ia. Andrew _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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In reply to this post by Alison M. Wheeler
On 1/26/06, Alison Wheeler <[hidden email]> wrote:
[snip] > > IMHO there is a separation between the operation of the Company/Charity > (with its separate legal identity, concerned with raising money, etc) and > the Chapter (probably more concerned with liaison between and support of > editors) although they may be two faces of the same organisation in > practice. IRC meetings are very suitable for the latter, face2face for the > former. > I'm still not sure if you are recommending a face to face meeting this weekend, or whether this was meant in a more general sense. Or have the plans for this meeting been abandoned for now? I'm asking this on a slightly selfish note, as my other plans have fallen through, and might leave London tomorrow. So should I hang on or not? Cormac _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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Cormax wrote
> I'm still not sure if you are recommending a face to face meeting this > weekend, or whether this was meant in a more general sense. Or have > the plans for this meeting been abandoned for now? I'm asking this on > a slightly selfish note, as my other plans have fallen through, and > might leave London tomorrow. So should I hang on or not? In this case I was meaning (initially) the general sense; so far as a meeting this Sunday is concerned we haven't heard from James (unless I've missed it - my email has been playing up a bit) and without his paperwork there'd be no point in a meeting for that purpose. Given it is now end of play on Friday I'm reading this as being that there is *no* meeting this Sunday (for the purposes of legal / the company, anyway) Separately, I was doing some research earlier and noted that all the correspondance on this list - discussing legal issues too - is available through a quick Google search as it is publicly acccessible. Especially given that there have been many matters which really shouldn't be public pre-registration this is somewhat worrying and, sfaiac, this list should not be used for company matters once a secure alternative is created. Matters discussing the improvement and activities of our wiki projects, etc. are certainly well-served by being here though. Alison _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
Re: Possible meeting date: Sunday 29th January, 2006.
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On 1/27/06, Alison Wheeler <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Cormax wrote > > I'm still not sure if you are recommending a face to face meeting this > > weekend, or whether this was meant in a more general sense. Or have > > the plans for this meeting been abandoned for now? I'm asking this on > > a slightly selfish note, as my other plans have fallen through, and > > might leave London tomorrow. So should I hang on or not? > > In this case I was meaning (initially) the general sense; so far as a > meeting this Sunday is concerned we haven't heard from James (unless I've > missed it - my email has been playing up a bit) and without his paperwork > there'd be no point in a meeting for that purpose. Given it is now end of > play on Friday I'm reading this as being that there is *no* meeting this > Sunday (for the purposes of legal / the company, anyway) Ok, thanks. Passing on what James wrote yesterday: "I think that it (incorporation) is premature, really; we still have to finally confirm the changes, and also wait for Board approval. I would be happy to have an IRC meeting this weekend, however, if people feel that it would be necessary." I agree with this - will head back home tomorrow, but would still take part in an IRC meeting if so desired. "Cormax" :-) _______________________________________________ Wikimedia UK mailing list [hidden email] http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_UK http://mail.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimediauk-l |
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