Read the VisualEditor process review

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
9 messages Options
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Read the VisualEditor process review

Neil Patel Quinn
Hello everybody!

For the past couple months, Joel Aufrecht and I have been working on a
project to document and improve the VisualEditor team's processes; we just
published a draft of our report
<https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Process_Review> on
mediawiki.org. If you're interested, please read it over and, of course,
shout at us on the talk page if we wrote anything stupid.

In addition to the team's significant strengths, we identified three major
challenges we'd like to work on:

   - Consulting stakeholders like Analytics and Design Research often have
   trouble engaging with VE’s development.
   - The process for early-stage requirements and design decision-making is
   informal and incomplete.
   - The team has a high reporting load which may no longer be justified.

Next week, we'll start to expand the report with some proposed solutions
(suggestions welcome!)

Have a good weekend!
—————
Neil P. Quinn <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Neil_P._Quinn-WMF>,
product analyst
Wikimedia Foundation
+1 (202) 656 3457
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [editing-department] Read the VisualEditor process review

Greg Grossmeier-2
<quote name="Neil P. Quinn" date="2015-06-05" time="16:56:07 -0700">
> Hello everybody!
>
> For the past couple months, Joel Aufrecht and I have been working on a
> project to document and improve the VisualEditor team's processes; we
> just published a draft of our report
> <https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Process_Review> on
> mediawiki.org. If you're interested, please read it over and, of
> course, shout at us on the talk page if we wrote anything stupid.


Neil et al, this is great! Thanks for the very informative read, even as
someone who works closely with the VE team on a semi-daily basis (at
least!). I think it is great that the time and energy was devoted to
developing this report.

The plan at [0] suggests that this is a one-time process with a
conclusion (which is good), thus it isn't tied in, explicitly, with the
quarterly goal planning process, correct?


Best,

Greg

[0] <https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Team_Process_Review#Plans>

--
| Greg Grossmeier            GPG: B2FA 27B1 F7EB D327 6B8E |
| identi.ca: @greg                A18D 1138 8E47 FAC8 1C7D |

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [editing-department] Read the VisualEditor process review

Neil Patel Quinn
Hey Greg!

Yes, this is meant to be a one-time process. We've been spending a
significant proportion of our time on it ever since we joined in mid-April
(I'd say about 30% for me, and probably more for Joel)—too much to make it
a regular thing. And hopefully, if we manage to address these problems, we
won't find them replaced by new ones the very next quarter :)

Thanks for the question—it feels great to know that someone is out there
reading our child of the mind!
—————
Neil P. Quinn <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Neil_P._Quinn-WMF>,
product analyst
Wikimedia Foundation
+1 (202) 656 3457

On Sat, Jun 6, 2015 at 3:34 PM, Greg Grossmeier <[hidden email]> wrote:

> <quote name="Neil P. Quinn" date="2015-06-05" time="16:56:07 -0700">
> > Hello everybody!
> >
> > For the past couple months, Joel Aufrecht and I have been working on a
> > project to document and improve the VisualEditor team's processes; we
> > just published a draft of our report
> > <https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Process_Review> on
> > mediawiki.org. If you're interested, please read it over and, of
> > course, shout at us on the talk page if we wrote anything stupid.
>
>
> Neil et al, this is great! Thanks for the very informative read, even as
> someone who works closely with the VE team on a semi-daily basis (at
> least!). I think it is great that the time and energy was devoted to
> developing this report.
>
> The plan at [0] suggests that this is a one-time process with a
> conclusion (which is good), thus it isn't tied in, explicitly, with the
> quarterly goal planning process, correct?
>
>
> Best,
>
> Greg
>
> [0] <
> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Team_Process_Review#Plans
> >
>
> --
> | Greg Grossmeier            GPG: B2FA 27B1 F7EB D327 6B8E |
> | identi.ca: @greg                A18D 1138 8E47 FAC8 1C7D |
>
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [editing-department] Read the VisualEditor process review

Risker
As a non-technical volunteer, I've drifted in and out of the VE discussion,
and have participated at wildly variable levels over the past few years.

I found this to be a very interesting and informative read - especially as
it came from people new to the entire history. It's good to have fresh eyes
on a situation.  Thank you for your work on this, it was quite
enlightening.

Risker/Anne

On 7 June 2015 at 00:09, Neil P. Quinn <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hey Greg!
>
> Yes, this is meant to be a one-time process. We've been spending a
> significant proportion of our time on it ever since we joined in mid-April
> (I'd say about 30% for me, and probably more for Joel)—too much to make it
> a regular thing. And hopefully, if we manage to address these problems, we
> won't find them replaced by new ones the very next quarter :)
>
> Thanks for the question—it feels great to know that someone is out there
> reading our child of the mind!
> —————
> Neil P. Quinn <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Neil_P._Quinn-WMF>,
> product analyst
> Wikimedia Foundation
> +1 (202) 656 3457
>
> On Sat, Jun 6, 2015 at 3:34 PM, Greg Grossmeier <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > <quote name="Neil P. Quinn" date="2015-06-05" time="16:56:07 -0700">
> > > Hello everybody!
> > >
> > > For the past couple months, Joel Aufrecht and I have been working on a
> > > project to document and improve the VisualEditor team's processes; we
> > > just published a draft of our report
> > > <https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Process_Review> on
> > > mediawiki.org. If you're interested, please read it over and, of
> > > course, shout at us on the talk page if we wrote anything stupid.
> >
> >
> > Neil et al, this is great! Thanks for the very informative read, even as
> > someone who works closely with the VE team on a semi-daily basis (at
> > least!). I think it is great that the time and energy was devoted to
> > developing this report.
> >
> > The plan at [0] suggests that this is a one-time process with a
> > conclusion (which is good), thus it isn't tied in, explicitly, with the
> > quarterly goal planning process, correct?
> >
> >
> > Best,
> >
> > Greg
> >
> > [0] <
> >
> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Team_Process_Review#Plans
> > >
> >
> > --
> > | Greg Grossmeier            GPG: B2FA 27B1 F7EB D327 6B8E |
> > | identi.ca: @greg                A18D 1138 8E47 FAC8 1C7D |
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [editing-department] Read the VisualEditor process review

Dan Garry
And, as a person that is not involved in the development of VisualEditor in
any way but knows many of the VisualEditor Team quite well, I also found
this very interesting. Thanks for putting it together!

Dan

On 6 June 2015 at 21:18, Risker <[hidden email]> wrote:

> As a non-technical volunteer, I've drifted in and out of the VE discussion,
> and have participated at wildly variable levels over the past few years.
>
> I found this to be a very interesting and informative read - especially as
> it came from people new to the entire history. It's good to have fresh eyes
> on a situation.  Thank you for your work on this, it was quite
> enlightening.
>
> Risker/Anne
>
> On 7 June 2015 at 00:09, Neil P. Quinn <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Hey Greg!
> >
> > Yes, this is meant to be a one-time process. We've been spending a
> > significant proportion of our time on it ever since we joined in
> mid-April
> > (I'd say about 30% for me, and probably more for Joel)—too much to make
> it
> > a regular thing. And hopefully, if we manage to address these problems,
> we
> > won't find them replaced by new ones the very next quarter :)
> >
> > Thanks for the question—it feels great to know that someone is out there
> > reading our child of the mind!
> > —————
> > Neil P. Quinn <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Neil_P._Quinn-WMF>,
> > product analyst
> > Wikimedia Foundation
> > +1 (202) 656 3457
> >
> > On Sat, Jun 6, 2015 at 3:34 PM, Greg Grossmeier <[hidden email]>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > <quote name="Neil P. Quinn" date="2015-06-05" time="16:56:07 -0700">
> > > > Hello everybody!
> > > >
> > > > For the past couple months, Joel Aufrecht and I have been working on
> a
> > > > project to document and improve the VisualEditor team's processes; we
> > > > just published a draft of our report
> > > > <https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Process_Review> on
> > > > mediawiki.org. If you're interested, please read it over and, of
> > > > course, shout at us on the talk page if we wrote anything stupid.
> > >
> > >
> > > Neil et al, this is great! Thanks for the very informative read, even
> as
> > > someone who works closely with the VE team on a semi-daily basis (at
> > > least!). I think it is great that the time and energy was devoted to
> > > developing this report.
> > >
> > > The plan at [0] suggests that this is a one-time process with a
> > > conclusion (which is good), thus it isn't tied in, explicitly, with the
> > > quarterly goal planning process, correct?
> > >
> > >
> > > Best,
> > >
> > > Greg
> > >
> > > [0] <
> > >
> >
> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Team_Process_Review#Plans
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > | Greg Grossmeier            GPG: B2FA 27B1 F7EB D327 6B8E |
> > > | identi.ca: @greg                A18D 1138 8E47 FAC8 1C7D |
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>



--
Dan Garry
Product Manager, Search and Discovery
Wikimedia Foundation
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Read the VisualEditor process review

Arthur Richards-2
In reply to this post by Neil Patel Quinn
x-posting to teampractices list

On Fri, Jun 5, 2015 at 4:56 PM, Neil P. Quinn <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hello everybody!
>
> For the past couple months, Joel Aufrecht and I have been working on a
> project to document and improve the VisualEditor team's processes; we just
> published a draft of our report
> <https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Process_Review> on
> mediawiki.org. If you're interested, please read it over and, of course,
> shout at us on the talk page if we wrote anything stupid.
>
> In addition to the team's significant strengths, we identified three major
> challenges we'd like to work on:
>
>    - Consulting stakeholders like Analytics and Design Research often have
>    trouble engaging with VE’s development.
>    - The process for early-stage requirements and design decision-making is
>    informal and incomplete.
>    - The team has a high reporting load which may no longer be justified.
>
> Next week, we'll start to expand the report with some proposed solutions
> (suggestions welcome!)
>
> Have a good weekend!
> —————
> Neil P. Quinn <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Neil_P._Quinn-WMF>,
> product analyst
> Wikimedia Foundation
> +1 (202) 656 3457
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l




--
Arthur Richards
Team Practices Manager
[[User:Awjrichards]]
IRC: awjr
+1-415-839-6885 x6687
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [editing-department] Read the VisualEditor process review

Joel Aufrecht
In reply to this post by Greg Grossmeier-2
Hi Greg,

The process improvement effort is not explicitly tied in with quarterly
goals.  If we come up with specific recommendations that require enough
effort to register on a quarterly scale, or that influence the output of
the team that much, they could be inputs to goal-setting.

Team Practices Group also does the quarterly Team Health Check survey,
which is also not part of quarterly goals.  I think that process
improvement in general is probably better handled separately from goals, to
avoid creating any incentives to bias measurement stats, consciously or
unconsciously.

Joel


*Joel Aufrecht*
Team Practices Group
Wikimedia Foundation

On Sat, Jun 6, 2015 at 3:34 PM, Greg Grossmeier <[hidden email]> wrote:

> <quote name="Neil P. Quinn" date="2015-06-05" time="16:56:07 -0700">
> > Hello everybody!
> >
> > For the past couple months, Joel Aufrecht and I have been working on a
> > project to document and improve the VisualEditor team's processes; we
> > just published a draft of our report
> > <https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Process_Review> on
> > mediawiki.org. If you're interested, please read it over and, of
> > course, shout at us on the talk page if we wrote anything stupid.
>
>
> Neil et al, this is great! Thanks for the very informative read, even as
> someone who works closely with the VE team on a semi-daily basis (at
> least!). I think it is great that the time and energy was devoted to
> developing this report.
>
> The plan at [0] suggests that this is a one-time process with a
> conclusion (which is good), thus it isn't tied in, explicitly, with the
> quarterly goal planning process, correct?
>
>
> Best,
>
> Greg
>
> [0] <
> https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Team_Process_Review#Plans
> >
>
> --
> | Greg Grossmeier            GPG: B2FA 27B1 F7EB D327 6B8E |
> | identi.ca: @greg                A18D 1138 8E47 FAC8 1C7D |
>
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: [editing-department] Read the VisualEditor process review

Pine W
Just to make sure that this has been said: thank you VE team, we appreciate
your work that will benefit Wikipedia for years to come.

Pine
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Read the VisualEditor process review

Scott MacLeod
In reply to this post by Neil Patel Quinn
Thanks, Greg, Joel and All,

Best,
Scott

Best, Scott
Hello everybody!

For the past couple months, Joel Aufrecht and I have been working on a
project to document and improve the VisualEditor team's processes; we just
published a draft of our report
<https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/VisualEditor/2015_Process_Review> on
mediawiki.org. If you're interested, please read it over and, of course,
shout at us on the talk page if we wrote anything stupid.

In addition to the team's significant strengths, we identified three major
challenges we'd like to work on:

   - Consulting stakeholders like Analytics and Design Research often have
   trouble engaging with VE’s development.
   - The process for early-stage requirements and design decision-making is
   informal and incomplete.
   - The team has a high reporting load which may no longer be justified.

Next week, we'll start to expand the report with some proposed solutions
(suggestions welcome!)

Have a good weekend!
—————
Neil P. Quinn <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Neil_P._Quinn-WMF>,
product analyst
Wikimedia Foundation
+1 (202) 656 3457
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l