Special:Wantedpages only once

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Special:Wantedpages only once

Plyd-2
Hello,

Special:Wantedpages doesn't mean anything now because it gives a too
high value to links included in very-used templates.

Is it possible to count template links only once ?

Plyd
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Re: Special:Wantedpages only once

Mathias Schindler-2
> Special:Wantedpages doesn't mean anything now because it gives a too
> high value to links included in very-used templates.
>
> Is it possible to count template links only once ?

See http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6011

Marked as Wontfix.

Mathias
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Re: Special:Wantedpages only once

Plyd-2
oops sorry...

On 6/1/06, Mathias Schindler <[hidden email]> wrote:

> > Special:Wantedpages doesn't mean anything now because it gives a too
> > high value to links included in very-used templates.
> >
> > Is it possible to count template links only once ?
>
> See http://bugzilla.wikimedia.org/show_bug.cgi?id=6011
>
> Marked as Wontfix.
>
> Mathias
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Re: Special:Wantedpages only once

Mathias Schindler-2
On 6/1/06, Plyd <[hidden email]> wrote:
> oops sorry...

not at all. I wish there was a solution for this the way you described it.

Mathias
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Re: Special:Wantedpages only once

Brion Vibber
In reply to this post by Plyd-2
Plyd wrote:
> Special:Wantedpages doesn't mean anything now because it gives a too
> high value to links included in very-used templates.

What is a "too high value"?

Broken links in massively-used templates are *EXACTLY* the sort of thing you
want to know about!

> Is it possible to count template links only once ?

That would be very harmful, as it would under-report the actual impact of the
breakage.

-- brion vibber (brion @ pobox.com)



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Re: Special:Wantedpages only once

Arne 'Timwi' Heizmann
Brion Vibber wrote:
> Plyd wrote:
>
>>Special:Wantedpages doesn't mean anything now because it gives a too
>>high value to links included in very-used templates.
>
> What is a "too high value"?
>
> Broken links in massively-used templates are *EXACTLY* the sort of thing you
> want to know about!

Weeell... five of the currently top-wanted articles are the redlinks in
[[Wikipedia:WikiProject Comics/Task template]]. That template is used on
all Talk pages that are claimed as part of that WikiProject (thousands,
apparently), but not in any actual articles. The redlinks don't actually
have any real impact.

Almost all of the currently-listed top-wanted articles appear to be on
the list because of this WikiProject talk-page template craziness. Some
appear to be on the list for no reason: their what-links-here list is
actually very short, but maybe they were linked to from such a template
when the wanted pages list was generated.

By the way -- notice that one of the redlinks is [[Project: Pegasus]],
which gets reinterpreted as [[Wikipedia:Pegasus]]. How would one fix this?

Timwi

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Re: Special:Wantedpages only once

Steve Bennett-4
In reply to this post by Brion Vibber
On 6/2/06, Brion Vibber <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Is it possible to count template links only once ?
>
> That would be very harmful, as it would under-report the actual impact of the
> breakage.

Does this discussion apply to images as well? If so, I can think of
times it would be useful to see how many times the image is applied
directly, rather than through a template such as a userbox. For
example, the "file links" for the Picture of the Day is always totally
useless, due to the number of people who transclude it via a template
on their user page. (see
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Monument_Valley_2.jpg).

Perhaps what is really needed is simply to be able to better
distinguish in lists such as "what links here" "genuine links" from
transcluded links, as they have different meanings:

Number of direct links: how many topics refer to this one, how many
people like this image, is this image actually being used in any
articles, and not just in userboxes.
Number of transcluded links: what is the impact of making a change,
how many people will see it...


Steve
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Re: Special:Wantedpages only once

Elliott F. Cable
I am thinking what it looks like we need is two special pages -  
because the 'wantedness' of the page, and the number of pages it  
shows up as a red link on, are two totally different things. For this  
new special page, I would recommend only counting templates once; and  
only counting stuff in the main namespace. Or at least, NOT in the  
talk namespace.

On Jun 2, 2006, at 8:10 AM, Steve Bennett wrote:

> On 6/2/06, Brion Vibber <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> Is it possible to count template links only once ?
>>
>> That would be very harmful, as it would under-report the actual  
>> impact of the
>> breakage.
>
> Does this discussion apply to images as well? If so, I can think of
> times it would be useful to see how many times the image is applied
> directly, rather than through a template such as a userbox. For
> example, the "file links" for the Picture of the Day is always totally
> useless, due to the number of people who transclude it via a template
> on their user page. (see
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Image:Monument_Valley_2.jpg).
>
> Perhaps what is really needed is simply to be able to better
> distinguish in lists such as "what links here" "genuine links" from
> transcluded links, as they have different meanings:
>
> Number of direct links: how many topics refer to this one, how many
> people like this image, is this image actually being used in any
> articles, and not just in userboxes.
> Number of transcluded links: what is the impact of making a change,
> how many people will see it...
>
>
> Steve
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

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Re: Special:Wantedpages only once

Steve Bennett-4
On 6/2/06, Elliott F. Cable <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I am thinking what it looks like we need is two special pages -
> because the 'wantedness' of the page, and the number of pages it
> shows up as a red link on, are two totally different things. For this
> new special page, I would recommend only counting templates once; and
> only counting stuff in the main namespace. Or at least, NOT in the
> talk namespace.

Sounds good. Dunno if it's still the case, but asteroids known only by
a 6 digit number always showed up high on the "most wanted" pages
previously, due to other asteroid articles linking to them or
something. There is lots of information that Wikipedia really badly
links, but detailed  info on obscure asteroids probably isn't it...

Steve
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Re: Special:Wantedpages only once

Elliott F. Cable
Well that could also be a problem... perhaps an administrator should  
be able to discard pages in a category from affecting it - for  
instance, if a massive asteroid-creation effort is going on, an admin  
could at request make dead links from pages in the  
[[Category:Asteroids]] not count or something... that seems pretty  
dumb, maybe there is a 'smarter' way to do it...

On Jun 2, 2006, at 2:34 PM, Steve Bennett wrote:

> On 6/2/06, Elliott F. Cable <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> I am thinking what it looks like we need is two special pages -
>> because the 'wantedness' of the page, and the number of pages it
>> shows up as a red link on, are two totally different things. For this
>> new special page, I would recommend only counting templates once; and
>> only counting stuff in the main namespace. Or at least, NOT in the
>> talk namespace.
>
> Sounds good. Dunno if it's still the case, but asteroids known only by
> a 6 digit number always showed up high on the "most wanted" pages
> previously, due to other asteroid articles linking to them or
> something. There is lots of information that Wikipedia really badly
> links, but detailed  info on obscure asteroids probably isn't it...
>
> Steve
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> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://mail.wikipedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

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