[TS logo] Fwd: Free as in Wikimedia Foundation

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[TS logo] Fwd: Free as in Wikimedia Foundation

Federico Leva (Nemo)



-------- Messaggio originale --------
Oggetto: [Wikimedia-l] Free as in Wikimedia Foundation
Data: Tue, 19 Mar 2013 13:12:04 +0100
Mittente: Tomasz W. Kozłowski
A: Wikimedia Mailing List

Hi community,
I would like to bring to your attention a matter that's currently
being discussed on Meta, one that has not yet gained too much interest
(though it was discussed during IRC office hours, and was mentioned on
one mailing list, as far as I see).

It seems that the Wikimedia Foundation registered a community logo
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Wikimedia_Community_Logo.svg> as
a trademark in the United States, with the international application
still pending.

The logo was originally created in 2006 by User:WarX (Artur
Fijałkowski) , and was adopted as the logo of Meta-Wiki in 2008 — and
as far as I can recall, the very point of it being created was to (1)
have a community logo released into the public domain and (2) to have
a community logo which was /not a trademark/.

I am especially worried about the WMF not informing the community
about their trademark registration — we have only found out about it
via an edit on Commons
<https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?diff=84864201&oldid=49625546>,
and then after asking about it during IRC office hours at the end of
January.

As far as I understand, the WMF has not discussed trademark
registration with the author of the logo
<https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?diff=92395329&oldid=92392542>
— though obviously, since Artur-WarX released it into the public
domain, it would've only be good manners, and not a legal requirement.

The discussion is taking place on Meta at
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Community_Logo>, and all
comments are welcome.

--
Tomasz W. Kozłowski
a.k.a. [[user:odder]]

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Re: [TS logo] Fwd: Free as in Wikimedia Foundation

Daniel Schwen-2
What a nonsense issue. This superfluous discussion is fueled by two
fallacies, the confusion of copyright and trademarking and an
unhealthy paranoia toward the foundation. Protection of logos
associated with the wikimedia community is a good thing. The
foundation is an asset to the community! They can offer legal support
in cases of abuse of wikimedia related symbology. It is absurd to
create a spectre of a community-suing evil foundation while at the
same tie ignoring the very real threat of dilution and abuse of
wikimedia symbols and resulting damage of wikimedia community
reputation by spam, phishing, link farming etc. sites.
Sorry, but this is alarmist hippie crap and typical "netizen-outrage".

On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 7:20 AM, Federico Leva (Nemo)
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>
>
>
> -------- Messaggio originale --------
> Oggetto: [Wikimedia-l] Free as in Wikimedia Foundation
> Data: Tue, 19 Mar 2013 13:12:04 +0100
> Mittente: Tomasz W. Kozłowski
> A: Wikimedia Mailing List
>
> Hi community,
> I would like to bring to your attention a matter that's currently
> being discussed on Meta, one that has not yet gained too much interest
> (though it was discussed during IRC office hours, and was mentioned on
> one mailing list, as far as I see).
>
> It seems that the Wikimedia Foundation registered a community logo
> <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Wikimedia_Community_Logo.svg> as
> a trademark in the United States, with the international application
> still pending.
>
> The logo was originally created in 2006 by User:WarX (Artur
> Fijałkowski) , and was adopted as the logo of Meta-Wiki in 2008 — and
> as far as I can recall, the very point of it being created was to (1)
> have a community logo released into the public domain and (2) to have
> a community logo which was /not a trademark/.
>
> I am especially worried about the WMF not informing the community
> about their trademark registration — we have only found out about it
> via an edit on Commons
> <https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?diff=84864201&oldid=49625546>,
> and then after asking about it during IRC office hours at the end of
> January.
>
> As far as I understand, the WMF has not discussed trademark
> registration with the author of the logo
> <https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?diff=92395329&oldid=92392542>
> — though obviously, since Artur-WarX released it into the public
> domain, it would've only be good manners, and not a legal requirement.
>
> The discussion is taking place on Meta at
> <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Talk:Community_Logo>, and all
> comments are welcome.
>
> --
> Tomasz W. Kozłowski
> a.k.a. [[user:odder]]
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
>
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Re: [TS logo] Fwd: Free as in Wikimedia Foundation

DaB.-2
Hello,
At Tuesday 19 March 2013 16:44:17 DaB. wrote:
> What a nonsense issue.

to formulate it a little bit less drastic: Somebody has to protect
(=trademark) the logo to prevent misuse. Because the community has no
international organization (AFAIK not even a local organization somewhere),
the WMF is the only candidate left.

Sincerely,
DaB.

--
Userpage: [[:w:de:User:DaB.]] — PGP: 0x2d3ee2d42b255885

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Re: [TS logo] Fwd: Free as in Wikimedia Foundation

Marc-Andre
In reply to this post by Daniel Schwen-2
On 03/19/2013 11:35 AM, Daniel Schwen wrote:
> Sorry, but this is alarmist hippie crap and typical "netizen-outrage".

I'm not sure I'd have put it in such strong words, but I agree that this
is very much overblown and misguided.

It's important that any marks not be misused for "evil" purposes, and
Trademark is the method to prevent it.  That the foundation is willing
to step up and handle the legalities is a /good/ thing.

Making sure nobody can use a mark for bad reasons *means* having to okay
proposed uses.  If you want something "everyone can use without asking
for any reason", you'll get something everyone *will* use for reasons
you wish they wouldn't -- and then have no way to stop them.

-- Coren / Marc


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Re: [TS logo] Fwd: Free as in Wikimedia Foundation

unitedcabletv
In reply to this post by DaB.-2
On 3/19/13, DaB. <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hello,
> At Tuesday 19 March 2013 16:44:17 DaB. wrote:
>> What a nonsense issue.
>
> to formulate it a little bit less drastic: Somebody has to protect
> (=trademark) the logo to prevent misuse. Because the community has no
> international organization (AFAIK not even a local organization somewhere),
>
> the WMF is the only candidate left.
>
> Sincerely,
> DaB.
>
> --
> Userpage: [[:w:de:User:DaB.]] — PGP: 0x2d3ee2d42b255885
>

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Re: [TS logo] Fwd: Free as in Wikimedia Foundation

Maciej Jaros
In reply to this post by Marc-Andre
Marc A. Pelletier (2013-03-19 17:32):

> On 03/19/2013 11:35 AM, Daniel Schwen wrote:
>> Sorry, but this is alarmist hippie crap and typical "netizen-outrage".
> I'm not sure I'd have put it in such strong words, but I agree that this
> is very much overblown and misguided.
>
> It's important that any marks not be misused for "evil" purposes, and
> Trademark is the method to prevent it.  That the foundation is willing
> to step up and handle the legalities is a /good/ thing.
>
> Making sure nobody can use a mark for bad reasons *means* having to okay
> proposed uses.  If you want something "everyone can use without asking
> for any reason", you'll get something everyone *will* use for reasons
> you wish they wouldn't -- and then have no way to stop them.

Not exactly. Somebody that takes some other people creation and claims
it's his commits a crime (at least by Polish law). Also authorship
formally cannot be transmitted by Polish law (only ownership can be
transmitted). So even PD doesn't really mean - do whatever you like.

Back to the point - it would be fair to simply e-mail the author before
trying to register the logo.

Regards,
Nux.

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OQ
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Re: [TS logo] Fwd: Free as in Wikimedia Foundation

OQ
On Tue, Mar 19, 2013 at 5:51 PM, Maciej Jaros <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> Not exactly. Somebody that takes some other people creation and claims it's
> his commits a crime (at least by Polish law). Also authorship formally
> cannot be transmitted by Polish law (only ownership can be transmitted). So
> even PD doesn't really mean - do whatever you like.
>

You just described copyright. This is trademarking.

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