Turkey ban

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Turkey ban

Denny Vrandečić-2
Does it also affect the app?

If so, why, and can we circumvent that?
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Re: Turkey ban

Neslihan Turan
Unfortunately, it does. According to news, the reason of the block is
some defamatory content about Turkey but it is not exactly known yet.

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Re: Turkey ban

Florian Schmidt
In reply to this post by Denny Vrandečić-2
Because the app uses the same base URL for the requests to Wikipedia as other access methods (e.g. internet browsers), a block a Wikipedia would apply to the App, too. Sorry, but there's no way to work around this, if a block is implemented to block all requests to a specific domain. One workaround on the client side would be to use a VPN, so that the request will be made from another origin and the answer forwarded to your phone/computer. However, I'm not sure, if this is allowed in any way.

Best,
Florian

-----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
Von: Wikitech-l [mailto:[hidden email]] Im Auftrag von Denny Vrandecic
Gesendet: Samstag, 29. April 2017 21:16
An: Wikimedia developers <[hidden email]>
Betreff: [Wikitech-l] Turkey ban

Does it also affect the app?

If so, why, and can we circumvent that?
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Re: Turkey ban

Denny Vrandečić-2
Surely it should be possible to have a more resilient access to Wikipedia
content in the app than most vanilla browsers provide?

On Sat, Apr 29, 2017, 13:40 Florian Schmidt <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Because the app uses the same base URL for the requests to Wikipedia as
> other access methods (e.g. internet browsers), a block a Wikipedia would
> apply to the App, too. Sorry, but there's no way to work around this, if a
> block is implemented to block all requests to a specific domain. One
> workaround on the client side would be to use a VPN, so that the request
> will be made from another origin and the answer forwarded to your
> phone/computer. However, I'm not sure, if this is allowed in any way.
>
> Best,
> Florian
>
> -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> Von: Wikitech-l [mailto:[hidden email]] Im
> Auftrag von Denny Vrandecic
> Gesendet: Samstag, 29. April 2017 21:16
> An: Wikimedia developers <[hidden email]>
> Betreff: [Wikitech-l] Turkey ban
>
> Does it also affect the app?
>
> If so, why, and can we circumvent that?
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
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Re: Turkey ban

Brion Vibber-4
The apps aren't currently designed with network-level blocking
circumvention in mind. It's certainly possible to be much more resilient
especially to something simple like a DNS blacklist, but:

* anything we do starts an arms race where smarter blocking could block
that too
* the apps are open source, so it's very easy to check how they work and
then design a fancier block
* such efforts might affect legal cases (IANAL)

-- brion



On Sat, Apr 29, 2017 at 1:47 PM, Denny Vrandečić <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Surely it should be possible to have a more resilient access to Wikipedia
> content in the app than most vanilla browsers provide?
>
> On Sat, Apr 29, 2017, 13:40 Florian Schmidt <
> [hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Because the app uses the same base URL for the requests to Wikipedia as
> > other access methods (e.g. internet browsers), a block a Wikipedia would
> > apply to the App, too. Sorry, but there's no way to work around this, if
> a
> > block is implemented to block all requests to a specific domain. One
> > workaround on the client side would be to use a VPN, so that the request
> > will be made from another origin and the answer forwarded to your
> > phone/computer. However, I'm not sure, if this is allowed in any way.
> >
> > Best,
> > Florian
> >
> > -----Ursprüngliche Nachricht-----
> > Von: Wikitech-l [mailto:[hidden email]] Im
> > Auftrag von Denny Vrandecic
> > Gesendet: Samstag, 29. April 2017 21:16
> > An: Wikimedia developers <[hidden email]>
> > Betreff: [Wikitech-l] Turkey ban
> >
> > Does it also affect the app?
> >
> > If so, why, and can we circumvent that?
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
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Re: Turkey ban

Bináris
When I was in Iran, I could reach all the blocked sites (such as Facebook)
with Psiphon.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psiphon
And so do the local people.
Citizens of dictatorships are very efficient in using client-side solutions.
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Re: Turkey ban

Amir Sarabadani-2
The Iranian government by blocking several major websites (youtube,
facebook, twitter) actually made people aware of anonymizers and people
were able to use a wide range of them.
Most popular ones that people in Turkey can use is: 1- Psiphon (a little
bit slow, has an android app) 2- Hotspot shield (great, also andriod app)
3- Lantern (the only one that supports linux)
Tor is good too but we have editing problems with that.

Best

On Sun, Apr 30, 2017 at 12:57 PM Bináris <[hidden email]> wrote:

> When I was in Iran, I could reach all the blocked sites (such as Facebook)
> with Psiphon.
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psiphon
> And so do the local people.
> Citizens of dictatorships are very efficient in using client-side
> solutions.
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
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Re: Turkey ban

Jonathan Morgan
And now, this:
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/05/20000-chinese-writers-will-create-their-own-wikipedia-competitor/

On Sun, Apr 30, 2017 at 1:39 AM, Amir Ladsgroup <[hidden email]> wrote:

> The Iranian government by blocking several major websites (youtube,
> facebook, twitter) actually made people aware of anonymizers and people
> were able to use a wide range of them.
> Most popular ones that people in Turkey can use is: 1- Psiphon (a little
> bit slow, has an android app) 2- Hotspot shield (great, also andriod app)
> 3- Lantern (the only one that supports linux)
> Tor is good too but we have editing problems with that.
>
> Best
>
> On Sun, Apr 30, 2017 at 12:57 PM Bináris <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > When I was in Iran, I could reach all the blocked sites (such as
> Facebook)
> > with Psiphon.
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psiphon
> > And so do the local people.
> > Citizens of dictatorships are very efficient in using client-side
> > solutions.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>



--
Jonathan T. Morgan
Senior Design Researcher
Wikimedia Foundation
User:Jmorgan (WMF) <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Jmorgan_(WMF)>
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Re: Turkey ban

Steinsplitter Wiki
I suspect if this will work, they also created on a own OS which... isn't popular at all.

________________________________
Von: Wikitech-l <[hidden email]> im Auftrag von Jonathan Morgan <[hidden email]>
Gesendet: Dienstag, 2. Mai 2017 18:00
An: Wikimedia developers
Betreff: Re: [Wikitech-l] Turkey ban

And now, this:
https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/05/20000-chinese-writers-will-create-their-own-wikipedia-competitor/

On Sun, Apr 30, 2017 at 1:39 AM, Amir Ladsgroup <[hidden email]> wrote:

> The Iranian government by blocking several major websites (youtube,
> facebook, twitter) actually made people aware of anonymizers and people
> were able to use a wide range of them.
> Most popular ones that people in Turkey can use is: 1- Psiphon (a little
> bit slow, has an android app) 2- Hotspot shield (great, also andriod app)
> 3- Lantern (the only one that supports linux)
> Tor is good too but we have editing problems with that.
>
> Best
>
> On Sun, Apr 30, 2017 at 12:57 PM Bináris <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > When I was in Iran, I could reach all the blocked sites (such as
> Facebook)
> > with Psiphon.
> > https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psiphon
> > And so do the local people.
> > Citizens of dictatorships are very efficient in using client-side
> > solutions.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>



--
Jonathan T. Morgan
Senior Design Researcher
Wikimedia Foundation
User:Jmorgan (WMF) <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Jmorgan_(WMF)>
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Re: Turkey ban

Ryan Kaldari-2
In reply to this post by Jonathan Morgan
I think that's the first time I've heard Wikipedia described as bewitching. I'll take it as a compliment.

FWIW, I have a hard time parsing this as bad news. Someone hiring 20,000 professional writers to create a freely accessible (though not distributable) encyclopedia is probably a net positive for humanity. I'm sure it will be heavily biased on political issues and heavily censored, but I doubt that will completely negate the value of the work. As an encyclopedia buff, I hope I can be forgiven for being secretly a little bit excited to hear about this effort. Cuba also has a state-sponsored Wikipedia competitor, EcuRed. Some of the articles are dripping with propaganda, but it's coverage of Cuban history and culture is actually much better than Wikipedia's (including Spanish Wikipedia). If this gives China an excuse to permanently block Wikipedia, I suppose it will be a net negative, but I guess we'll have to wait and see.

You are now free to tar and feather me!

> On May 2, 2017, at 9:00 AM, Jonathan Morgan <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> And now, this:
> https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/05/20000-chinese-writers-will-create-their-own-wikipedia-competitor/
>
>> On Sun, Apr 30, 2017 at 1:39 AM, Amir Ladsgroup <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> The Iranian government by blocking several major websites (youtube,
>> facebook, twitter) actually made people aware of anonymizers and people
>> were able to use a wide range of them.
>> Most popular ones that people in Turkey can use is: 1- Psiphon (a little
>> bit slow, has an android app) 2- Hotspot shield (great, also andriod app)
>> 3- Lantern (the only one that supports linux)
>> Tor is good too but we have editing problems with that.
>>
>> Best
>>
>>> On Sun, Apr 30, 2017 at 12:57 PM Bináris <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>
>>> When I was in Iran, I could reach all the blocked sites (such as
>> Facebook)
>>> with Psiphon.
>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Psiphon
>>> And so do the local people.
>>> Citizens of dictatorships are very efficient in using client-side
>>> solutions.
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wikitech-l mailing list
>>> [hidden email]
>>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikitech-l mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Jonathan T. Morgan
> Senior Design Researcher
> Wikimedia Foundation
> User:Jmorgan (WMF) <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/User:Jmorgan_(WMF)>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

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Re: Turkey ban

Keegan Peterzell-2
In reply to this post by Jonathan Morgan
On Tue, May 2, 2017 at 11:00 AM, Jonathan Morgan <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> And now, this:
> https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/05/20000-chinese-
> writers-will-create-their-own-wikipedia-competitor/
>
>
​IIRC, China has been announcing such an initiative in various forms almost
perennially since Wikipedia became popular in the mid-aughts, and every
time the tech journalists go nuts.

--
Keegan Peterzell
Technical Collaboration Specialist
Wikimedia Foundation
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Re: Turkey ban

David Gerard-2
In reply to this post by Ryan Kaldari-2
On 2 May 2017 at 18:18, Ryan Kaldari <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I think that's the first time I've heard Wikipedia described as bewitching. I'll take it as a compliment.
> FWIW, I have a hard time parsing this as bad news. Someone hiring 20,000 professional writers to create a freely accessible (though not distributable) encyclopedia is probably a net positive for humanity. I'm sure it will be heavily biased on political issues and heavily censored, but I doubt that will completely negate the value of the work. As an encyclopedia buff, I hope I can be forgiven for being secretly a little bit excited to hear about this effort. Cuba also has a state-sponsored Wikipedia competitor, EcuRed. Some of the articles are dripping with propaganda, but it's coverage of Cuban history and culture is actually much better than Wikipedia's (including Spanish Wikipedia). If this gives China an excuse to permanently block Wikipedia, I suppose it will be a net negative, but I guess we'll have to wait and see.
> You are now free to tar and feather me!


I think you've hit the key point - we need this to be released under a
proper free content license :-D

(probably increasingly off topic for the dev list ... maybe see if
they have useful changes to contribute back to MW)


- d.

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Re: Turkey ban

Andre Klapper-2
In reply to this post by Jonathan Morgan
On Tue, 2017-05-02 at 09:00 -0700, Jonathan Morgan wrote:
> And now, this:
> https://arstechnica.com/tech-policy/2017/05/20000-chinese-writers-wil
> l-create-their-own-wikipedia-competitor/

I don't see much relation to the topic. There have been already issues
connecting to Wikipedia in China, and there are already larger Chinese
online encyclopedia projects (Baidu's Baike has ~13mio articles).

andre
--
Andre Klapper | Wikimedia Bugwrangler
http://blogs.gnome.org/aklapper/

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