Why isn't hotcat an extension?

classic Classic list List threaded Threaded
40 messages Options
12
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Yuvi Panda
It's universally liked, is there almost on every wiki, and provides a
much needed functionality. Why isn't this deployed as an extension, or
better yet - part of core, than as a gadget? Just a matter of someone
to do the work?

--
Yuvi Panda T
http://yuvi.in/blog

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Derk-Jan Hartman
In general, because extensions are not as easy to maintain as wikipages are for Gadget developers. They don't WANT to use gerrit, git, go trough review, etc. It's the same reason why we have a ton of toolserver projects that could easily be extensions.

DJ

On 17 jul. 2013, at 23:52, Yuvi Panda <[hidden email]> wrote:

> It's universally liked, is there almost on every wiki, and provides a
> much needed functionality. Why isn't this deployed as an extension, or
> better yet - part of core, than as a gadget? Just a matter of someone
> to do the work?
>
> --
> Yuvi Panda T
> http://yuvi.in/blog
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l


_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Amir E. Aharoni
In reply to this post by Yuvi Panda
Three years ago I would agree completely and immediately that it
should be an extension, especially with localization in mind, but
nowadays VE already does category editing quite well.

That said, VE still requires entering the editing mode and then
clicking another button. Editing *only* categories is a very frequent
scenario. An extension, or a kind of a VE module, that only edits
categories would definitely be useful.

Please don't see it as stop energy - it's just a thought.

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
http://aharoni.wordpress.com
‪“We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬


2013/7/18 Yuvi Panda <[hidden email]>:

> It's universally liked, is there almost on every wiki, and provides a
> much needed functionality. Why isn't this deployed as an extension, or
> better yet - part of core, than as a gadget? Just a matter of someone
> to do the work?
>
> --
> Yuvi Panda T
> http://yuvi.in/blog
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Jon Robson
In reply to this post by Yuvi Panda
I'd really like to see a review process where Gadgets move from Gadget
status to core. To me a Gadget is a great way to explore a new type of
functionality and prove it's worth but it comes with a cost - it's
very difficult to ensure a Gadget doesn't breaking with core changes
or with the installation of some other extension/gadget. I can imagine
this would also be the developer equivalent of a barn star - such a
promotion I'd hope would be very flattering to authors and would
encourage Gadget writing and innovation. Likewise if a gadget is not
being used we should not leave it install on a wiki.

If people don't want to put their code through review this is scary to
me - surely the standards of any code we put out to users should be of
the highest quality..? We should not be scared of code review and see
it as a positive thing that builds our knowledge up and makes us be
the best we possibly can. If this is seen as a bad thing we really
need to ask ourselves questions about the review process.

If people are scared of using Gerrit/Git we should create nicer
interfaces into it.. no?

(Note for those not familiar with what HotCat is:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:HotCat)

On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 2:52 PM, Yuvi Panda <[hidden email]> wrote:

> It's universally liked, is there almost on every wiki, and provides a
> much needed functionality. Why isn't this deployed as an extension, or
> better yet - part of core, than as a gadget? Just a matter of someone
> to do the work?
>
> --
> Yuvi Panda T
> http://yuvi.in/blog
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l



--
Jon Robson
http://jonrobson.me.uk
@rakugojon

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Yuvi Panda
On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 3:38 AM, Jon Robson <[hidden email]> wrote:
> If people are scared of using Gerrit/Git we should create nicer
> interfaces into it.. no?

:)

This 'upgrade' happened to WikiLove, IIRC. Should also happen to HotCat, IMO.

--
Yuvi Panda T
http://yuvi.in/blog

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Tyler Romeo
In reply to this post by Jon Robson
I agree with this. Just for those who want to take a look at the raw
JavaScript code for HotCat:
https://commons.wikimedia.org/w/index.php?title=MediaWiki:Gadget-HotCat.js

It would probably take me a good week just to understand what's going on in
that mess.
**It has custom JSON and AJAX functions from when HotCat was developed
without jQuery support.**
You read that write. Not only does it use a normal edit form rather than
attempting to do something with the API (because there is no API module for
this), but it also has custom jQuery-like functions.

This could be vastly simplified with a nice extension. But, as said, if VE
already has such a feature, maybe it's not even worth it...

*-- *
*Tyler Romeo*
Stevens Institute of Technology, Class of 2016
Major in Computer Science
www.whizkidztech.com | [hidden email]


On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 6:08 PM, Jon Robson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'd really like to see a review process where Gadgets move from Gadget
> status to core. To me a Gadget is a great way to explore a new type of
> functionality and prove it's worth but it comes with a cost - it's
> very difficult to ensure a Gadget doesn't breaking with core changes
> or with the installation of some other extension/gadget. I can imagine
> this would also be the developer equivalent of a barn star - such a
> promotion I'd hope would be very flattering to authors and would
> encourage Gadget writing and innovation. Likewise if a gadget is not
> being used we should not leave it install on a wiki.
>
> If people don't want to put their code through review this is scary to
> me - surely the standards of any code we put out to users should be of
> the highest quality..? We should not be scared of code review and see
> it as a positive thing that builds our knowledge up and makes us be
> the best we possibly can. If this is seen as a bad thing we really
> need to ask ourselves questions about the review process.
>
> If people are scared of using Gerrit/Git we should create nicer
> interfaces into it.. no?
>
> (Note for those not familiar with what HotCat is:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:HotCat)
>
> On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 2:52 PM, Yuvi Panda <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > It's universally liked, is there almost on every wiki, and provides a
> > much needed functionality. Why isn't this deployed as an extension, or
> > better yet - part of core, than as a gadget? Just a matter of someone
> > to do the work?
> >
> > --
> > Yuvi Panda T
> > http://yuvi.in/blog
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
>
>
> --
> Jon Robson
> http://jonrobson.me.uk
> @rakugojon
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Yuvi Panda
In reply to this post by Yuvi Panda
Looking at https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/MediaWiki:Gadget-HotCat.js,
it probably could also be vastly simplified by jQuery-fying
everything, and dropping support for ancient MW versions.

Perhaps there is already an extension that does this?

--
Yuvi Panda T
http://yuvi.in/blog

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Derk-Jan Hartman
In reply to this post by Jon Robson
"If people don't want to put their code through review this is scary to me"

They do get their code reviewed. The rules are however usually simple 'it needs to work'. Not everyone has time to spend a gazillion hours on getting familiar with git, gerrit, jshint, git-review, resourceloader, i18n, l10n, the actual review lag, the deploy lag and I don't know what else.

Some ppl just want to edit categories super fast NOW. That's how these tools start and then these people are usually done. A bit of required maintenance, but that's it, they are editing/reviewing/categorizing again. Look at navpopups. With minor changes, that thing has been able to run basically unsupervised since 2006 and it is one of the most popular tools.

So people want to make extensions out of JS code, just do it, but some people don't and you should respect that.

To get what you want, you need:

1: Flagged revisions/review for .css/.js wikipages
2: CSS/JS editor for wikipage with JSHint integrated etc integrated
3: i18n support for gadgets.
4: Global repositories for gadgets
5: Integrated versioning and updating for 'installed' scripts
6: Autogenerated documentation

Then ppl will come flocking.

DJ

On 18 jul. 2013, at 00:08, Jon Robson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I'd really like to see a review process where Gadgets move from Gadget
> status to core. To me a Gadget is a great way to explore a new type of
> functionality and prove it's worth but it comes with a cost - it's
> very difficult to ensure a Gadget doesn't breaking with core changes
> or with the installation of some other extension/gadget. I can imagine
> this would also be the developer equivalent of a barn star - such a
> promotion I'd hope would be very flattering to authors and would
> encourage Gadget writing and innovation. Likewise if a gadget is not
> being used we should not leave it install on a wiki.
>
> If people don't want to put their code through review this is scary to
> me - surely the standards of any code we put out to users should be of
> the highest quality..? We should not be scared of code review and see
> it as a positive thing that builds our knowledge up and makes us be
> the best we possibly can. If this is seen as a bad thing we really
> need to ask ourselves questions about the review process.
>
> If people are scared of using Gerrit/Git we should create nicer
> interfaces into it.. no?
>
> (Note for those not familiar with what HotCat is:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:HotCat)
>
> On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 2:52 PM, Yuvi Panda <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> It's universally liked, is there almost on every wiki, and provides a
>> much needed functionality. Why isn't this deployed as an extension, or
>> better yet - part of core, than as a gadget? Just a matter of someone
>> to do the work?
>>
>> --
>> Yuvi Panda T
>> http://yuvi.in/blog
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikitech-l mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
>
>
> --
> Jon Robson
> http://jonrobson.me.uk
> @rakugojon
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l


_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Yuvi Panda
In reply to this post by Tyler Romeo
On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 3:48 AM, Tyler Romeo <[hidden email]> wrote:
> This could be vastly simplified with a nice extension. But, as said, if VE
> already has such a feature, maybe it's not even worth it...

Don't think so. Commons is a use case that comes to mind, but I am
guessing that having a quick way to edit categories should exist
independent of VE for all wikis regardless.



--
Yuvi Panda T
http://yuvi.in/blog

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Jon Robson
In reply to this post by Derk-Jan Hartman
On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 3:22 PM, Derk-Jan Hartman
<[hidden email]> wrote:
> "If people don't want to put their code through review this is scary to me"
>
> They do get their code reviewed. The rules are however usually simple 'it needs to work'. Not everyone has time to spend a gazillion hours on getting familiar with git, gerrit, jshint, git-review, resourceloader, i18n, l10n, the actual review lag, the deploy lag and I don't know what else.
>
> Some ppl just want to edit categories super fast NOW. That's how these tools start and then these people are usually done. A bit of required maintenance, but that's it, they are editing/reviewing/categorizing again. Look at navpopups. With minor changes, that thing has been able to run basically unsupervised since 2006 and it is one of the most popular tools.

This seems like a bad habit to have got ourselves into...
All it takes is a trailing comma somewhere and a gadget could take out
a whole browser.
Likewise a bad usage of a css transition can completely kill site
performance and make everything laggy.
I'm not disagreeing that this workflow gets results - it obviously
does - but I think we should be striving to identify good Gadgets and
giving them love and attention for the good of everyone.

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Derk-Jan Hartman

On 18 jul. 2013, at 00:25, Jon Robson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 3:22 PM, Derk-Jan Hartman
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> "If people don't want to put their code through review this is scary to me"
>>
>> They do get their code reviewed. The rules are however usually simple 'it needs to work'. Not everyone has time to spend a gazillion hours on getting familiar with git, gerrit, jshint, git-review, resourceloader, i18n, l10n, the actual review lag, the deploy lag and I don't know what else.
>>
>> Some ppl just want to edit categories super fast NOW. That's how these tools start and then these people are usually done. A bit of required maintenance, but that's it, they are editing/reviewing/categorizing again. Look at navpopups. With minor changes, that thing has been able to run basically unsupervised since 2006 and it is one of the most popular tools.
>
> This seems like a bad habit to have got ourselves into...
> All it takes is a trailing comma somewhere and a gadget could take out
> a whole browser.
> Likewise a bad usage of a css transition can completely kill site
> performance and make everything laggy.
> I'm not disagreeing that this workflow gets results - it obviously
> does - but I think we should be striving to identify good Gadgets and
> giving them love and attention for the good of everyone.


Like I said, I just don't think that Extensions and our current Developer workflow are a good fit for that love and attention.

DJ
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Tyler Romeo
Quick question, is there a way in the API (other than action=edit) to
add/remove categories from a page? Because that seems to be one of the main
things that would be holding this back from becoming an extension proper.

*-- *
*Tyler Romeo*
Stevens Institute of Technology, Class of 2016
Major in Computer Science
www.whizkidztech.com | [hidden email]


On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 6:31 PM, Derk-Jan Hartman <
[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> On 18 jul. 2013, at 00:25, Jon Robson <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 3:22 PM, Derk-Jan Hartman
> > <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> "If people don't want to put their code through review this is scary to
> me"
> >>
> >> They do get their code reviewed. The rules are however usually simple
> 'it needs to work'. Not everyone has time to spend a gazillion hours on
> getting familiar with git, gerrit, jshint, git-review, resourceloader,
> i18n, l10n, the actual review lag, the deploy lag and I don't know what
> else.
> >>
> >> Some ppl just want to edit categories super fast NOW. That's how these
> tools start and then these people are usually done. A bit of required
> maintenance, but that's it, they are editing/reviewing/categorizing again.
> Look at navpopups. With minor changes, that thing has been able to run
> basically unsupervised since 2006 and it is one of the most popular tools.
> >
> > This seems like a bad habit to have got ourselves into...
> > All it takes is a trailing comma somewhere and a gadget could take out
> > a whole browser.
> > Likewise a bad usage of a css transition can completely kill site
> > performance and make everything laggy.
> > I'm not disagreeing that this workflow gets results - it obviously
> > does - but I think we should be striving to identify good Gadgets and
> > giving them love and attention for the good of everyone.
>
>
> Like I said, I just don't think that Extensions and our current Developer
> workflow are a good fit for that love and attention.
>
> DJ
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Yuvi Panda
On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 4:06 AM, Tyler Romeo <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Quick question, is there a way in the API (other than action=edit) to
> add/remove categories from a page? Because that seems to be one of the main
> things that would be holding this back from becoming an extension proper.

There isn't currently (we hit this in the mobile commons app).
Currently we have to get the wikitext, parse out the categories (eek
wikitext), and then add/replace/edit them. Regexes all over. Not fun.

But fixing that would take a lot more work, I think.


--
Yuvi Panda T
http://yuvi.in/blog

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Jon Robson
Had a quick chat with jared Zimmerman (cced) around this (who's not on
this mailing list)

He says:
"HotCat is number one on my list of gadgets to get some UX love and
turn into a beta experiment... If everything goes well while its in
experiments then it gets integrated into core extensions. Mark H. is
coding the desktop beta experiments framework right now (literally
while I write this email)"


On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 3:40 PM, Yuvi Panda <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 4:06 AM, Tyler Romeo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Quick question, is there a way in the API (other than action=edit) to
>> add/remove categories from a page? Because that seems to be one of the main
>> things that would be holding this back from becoming an extension proper.
>
> There isn't currently (we hit this in the mobile commons app).
> Currently we have to get the wikitext, parse out the categories (eek
> wikitext), and then add/replace/edit them. Regexes all over. Not fun.
>
> But fixing that would take a lot more work, I think.
>
>
> --
> Yuvi Panda T
> http://yuvi.in/blog
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l



--
Jon Robson
http://jonrobson.me.uk
@rakugojon

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Yuvi Panda
On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 4:57 AM, Jon Robson <[hidden email]> wrote:
> He says:
> "HotCat is number one on my list of gadgets to get some UX love and
> turn into a beta experiment... If everything goes well while its in
> experiments then it gets integrated into core extensions. Mark H. is
> coding the desktop beta experiments framework right now (literally
> while I write this email)"

Can you explain what this means? Is hexmode writing HotCat? Is he
writing a framework to enable experiments on desktop? Was that
discussed / announced anywhere?


--
Yuvi Panda T
http://yuvi.in/blog

_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Derk-Jan Hartman
In reply to this post by Jon Robson
CC Lupo, who is the primary maintainer of that Gadget for years.

DJ

On 18 jul. 2013, at 01:27, Jon Robson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Had a quick chat with jared Zimmerman (cced) around this (who's not on
> this mailing list)
>
> He says:
> "HotCat is number one on my list of gadgets to get some UX love and
> turn into a beta experiment... If everything goes well while its in
> experiments then it gets integrated into core extensions. Mark H. is
> coding the desktop beta experiments framework right now (literally
> while I write this email)"
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 3:40 PM, Yuvi Panda <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 4:06 AM, Tyler Romeo <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> Quick question, is there a way in the API (other than action=edit) to
>>> add/remove categories from a page? Because that seems to be one of the main
>>> things that would be holding this back from becoming an extension proper.
>>
>> There isn't currently (we hit this in the mobile commons app).
>> Currently we have to get the wikitext, parse out the categories (eek
>> wikitext), and then add/replace/edit them. Regexes all over. Not fun.
>>
>> But fixing that would take a lot more work, I think.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Yuvi Panda T
>> http://yuvi.in/blog
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikitech-l mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
>
>
> --
> Jon Robson
> http://jonrobson.me.uk
> @rakugojon
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l


_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

C. Scott Ananian
In reply to this post by Yuvi Panda
Parsoid would make pulling out and editing the category tags much easier.
This might be an interesting test case for the parsoid-DOM future.
  --scott
On Jul 17, 2013 6:41 PM, "Yuvi Panda" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 4:06 AM, Tyler Romeo <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Quick question, is there a way in the API (other than action=edit) to
> > add/remove categories from a page? Because that seems to be one of the
> main
> > things that would be holding this back from becoming an extension proper.
>
> There isn't currently (we hit this in the mobile commons app).
> Currently we have to get the wikitext, parse out the categories (eek
> wikitext), and then add/replace/edit them. Regexes all over. Not fun.
>
> But fixing that would take a lot more work, I think.
>
>
> --
> Yuvi Panda T
> http://yuvi.in/blog
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Jon Robson
In reply to this post by Yuvi Panda
+wiki tech
On 17 Jul 2013 17:39, "Jared Zimmerman" <[hidden email]>
wrote:

Hey Yuvi,

the link got stripped from the mailing list email but its here
http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Beta_Experiments Mark Holmquist is the dev on
the feature.

Currently Mark is working on the Beta Experiments framework (nothing to do
with HotCat, yet or planned) The first experiment will be an updated
gallery control that is part of the upcoming Multimedia improvements lead
by Fabrice.

However once the framework is in place it should be much easier for
designer and developers to create experiments on the desktop site. Unlike
gadgets the plan is that code goes into Beta, is validated, feedback is
given from the community and its either scrapped, iterated, or integrated,
rather than stagnating in gadgets forever.

You can see in the image on the feature page above some hints at other
ideas we have for experiments in the future.

Let me know if you have bandwidth or 20% time to participate in working
with the design team to either create new experiments or help migrate some
of the more established gadgets into the Beta Experiments environment.

Jared



*
*
*
*
*Jared Zimmerman * \\  Director of User Experience \\ Wikimedia
Foundation
M : +1 415 609 4043 |   :  @JaredZimmerman<https://twitter.com/JaredZimmerman>



On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 4:38 PM, Yuvi Panda <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 4:57 AM, Jon Robson <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > He says:
> > "HotCat is number one on my list of gadgets to get some UX love and
> > turn into a beta experiment... If everything goes well while its in
> > experiments then it gets integrated into core extensions. Mark H. is
> > coding the desktop beta experiments framework right now (literally
> > while I write this email)"
>
> Can you explain what this means? Is hexmode writing HotCat? Is he
> writing a framework to enable experiments on desktop? Was that
> discussed / announced anywhere?
>
>
> --
> Yuvi Panda T
> http://yuvi.in/blog
>
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Tyler Romeo
Well in that case I might as well start working on a HotCat extension...

*-- *
*Tyler Romeo*
Stevens Institute of Technology, Class of 2016
Major in Computer Science
www.whizkidztech.com | [hidden email]


On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 8:50 PM, Jon Robson <[hidden email]> wrote:

> +wiki tech
> On 17 Jul 2013 17:39, "Jared Zimmerman" <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> Hey Yuvi,
>
> the link got stripped from the mailing list email but its here
> http://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Beta_Experiments Mark Holmquist is the dev
> on
> the feature.
>
> Currently Mark is working on the Beta Experiments framework (nothing to do
> with HotCat, yet or planned) The first experiment will be an updated
> gallery control that is part of the upcoming Multimedia improvements lead
> by Fabrice.
>
> However once the framework is in place it should be much easier for
> designer and developers to create experiments on the desktop site. Unlike
> gadgets the plan is that code goes into Beta, is validated, feedback is
> given from the community and its either scrapped, iterated, or integrated,
> rather than stagnating in gadgets forever.
>
> You can see in the image on the feature page above some hints at other
> ideas we have for experiments in the future.
>
> Let me know if you have bandwidth or 20% time to participate in working
> with the design team to either create new experiments or help migrate some
> of the more established gadgets into the Beta Experiments environment.
>
> Jared
>
>
>
> *
> *
> *
> *
> *Jared Zimmerman * \\  Director of User Experience \\ Wikimedia
> Foundation
> M : +1 415 609 4043 |   :  @JaredZimmerman<
> https://twitter.com/JaredZimmerman>
>
>
>
> On Wed, Jul 17, 2013 at 4:38 PM, Yuvi Panda <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > On Thu, Jul 18, 2013 at 4:57 AM, Jon Robson <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > He says:
> > > "HotCat is number one on my list of gadgets to get some UX love and
> > > turn into a beta experiment... If everything goes well while its in
> > > experiments then it gets integrated into core extensions. Mark H. is
> > > coding the desktop beta experiments framework right now (literally
> > > while I write this email)"
> >
> > Can you explain what this means? Is hexmode writing HotCat? Is he
> > writing a framework to enable experiments on desktop? Was that
> > discussed / announced anywhere?
> >
> >
> > --
> > Yuvi Panda T
> > http://yuvi.in/blog
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
Reply | Threaded
Open this post in threaded view
|

Re: Why isn't hotcat an extension?

Risker
In reply to this post by Amir E. Aharoni
On 17 July 2013 18:05, Amir E. Aharoni <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Three years ago I would agree completely and immediately that it
> should be an extension, especially with localization in mind, but
> nowadays VE already does category editing quite well.
>
>
This might come as a surprise to those who are trying to use VE to
categorize articles; we're not seeing a lot of positive effect on enwiki at
present, although perhaps if all the bugs/enhancements are done it might be
more workable.  I think it would be unfair to the team working on VE right
now to suggest that it should be all that close to the top priority,
particularly as categorization is almost exclusively done by experienced
editors.

I note that someone commented below about WikiLove.  While it's a nice
extension, it's also had to be disabled on multiple occasions on enwiki for
various problems.

Risker
_______________________________________________
Wikitech-l mailing list
[hidden email]
https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
12