[Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

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[Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

MZMcBride-2
Hi.

Is there a community consultation period built in to the selection process
for a new Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director? If not, should there be?

In trying to figure out what the selection process may look like, I
re-reviewed some of the relevant FAQs and timelines:

* https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/90968
* https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/91132
* https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/7127367

As I understand the basic process, the Transition Team will ultimately
find a suitable candidate and will make a recommendation to the Wikimedia
Foundation Board of Trustees. (Please correct me if this description is
mistaken... this is largely unchartered territory for Wikimedia.)

When this recommendation is made and prior to the Board voting, should the
Wikimedia community have the opportunity to weigh in on the candidate
Selection prior to final approval? If so, in what way?

These questions are not meant to suggest that the Wikimedia community and
the Transition Team have not been working together already (e.g., in
creating a connectors list, drafting interview questions, etc.).

While nobody would reasonably argue that every Wikimedia Foundation
employee be vetted by the Wikimedia community, it seems to me that this
particular position is unique given its enormous influence in shaping
Wikimedia's course. As I understand it, the Wikimedia Foundation Board of
Trustees is (s)elected to ultimately make the choice of who oversees the
daily operations of the Wikimedia Foundation as Executive Director.
However, I believe that ensuring that the community is adequately
consulted is important.

Relatedly, I've asked the Executive Director Transition Team on-wiki about
the possibility of more regular status updates on its progress in some
form (mailing list posts, wiki page updates, etc.).

MZMcBride



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Federico Leva (Nemo)
I don't know what to think about a final community consultation on a
specific name. Personally I suspect that I wouldn't be able to say
anything about it, as with
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Executive_Director_Transition_Team/Update_9_December>.
        Speaking of which, I wonder how the problems there were addressed:
apparently they just expanded the search and reduced the number of
people participating, but I see no answers to the question: «Have we
been looking for a unicorn -- somebody who doesn't exist in the real
world? [...] too insular? [...] unfairly comparing [...]?».
        If an answer was found, I'd like to know it. To me that only looked
like a rhetorical question, because of course I have no idea what exact
criteria/questions/interview practices are being applied or if unfair
comparisons were made. To avoid another fiasco, it would probably be
useful to publish on Meta an anonymised table of candidates, pointing
out strengths and weaknesses in a single line for each. Then one could
say «oh, look, "criterion" 175 made 12 otherwise awesome candidates
"fail", do we really need it?».

Nemo

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Jan-Bart de Vreede-3
In reply to this post by MZMcBride-2
Hey

There is no “community consultation” period in the selection proces. Its simply not feasible or desirable to have someone have a public “vetting” phase. The good news is that you elected representatives on the board who have a strong voice in the selection process and final approval.

Jan-Bart de Vreede
Chair Wikimedia Board of Trustees


On 18 Jan 2014, at 06:58, MZMcBride <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi.
>
> Is there a community consultation period built in to the selection process
> for a new Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director? If not, should there be?
>
> In trying to figure out what the selection process may look like, I
> re-reviewed some of the relevant FAQs and timelines:
>
> * https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/90968
> * https://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/91132
> * https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:Permalink/7127367
>
> As I understand the basic process, the Transition Team will ultimately
> find a suitable candidate and will make a recommendation to the Wikimedia
> Foundation Board of Trustees. (Please correct me if this description is
> mistaken... this is largely unchartered territory for Wikimedia.)
>
> When this recommendation is made and prior to the Board voting, should the
> Wikimedia community have the opportunity to weigh in on the candidate
> Selection prior to final approval? If so, in what way?
>
> These questions are not meant to suggest that the Wikimedia community and
> the Transition Team have not been working together already (e.g., in
> creating a connectors list, drafting interview questions, etc.).
>
> While nobody would reasonably argue that every Wikimedia Foundation
> employee be vetted by the Wikimedia community, it seems to me that this
> particular position is unique given its enormous influence in shaping
> Wikimedia's course. As I understand it, the Wikimedia Foundation Board of
> Trustees is (s)elected to ultimately make the choice of who oversees the
> daily operations of the Wikimedia Foundation as Executive Director.
> However, I believe that ensuring that the community is adequately
> consulted is important.
>
> Relatedly, I've asked the Executive Director Transition Team on-wiki about
> the possibility of more regular status updates on its progress in some
> form (mailing list posts, wiki page updates, etc.).
>
> MZMcBride
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Jan-Bart de Vreede-3
In reply to this post by Federico Leva (Nemo)
Hey Frederico

I will write an update for the meta page in the coming week or so but just to give you a general sense of where we are at: we are trying to reach potential candidates in a different way, and so far that looks like a good strategy. This means more direct contact between the Foundation and candidates and more pro-actively reaching out to people who initially showed no interest.

There is no scientific way to make the trade-off between characteristics/skills of candidates. We might very well choose to ignore an important characteristic if all the others fall into place. And it is of course easier to make a trade-off on less significant characteristics and skills. The decision to look for more candidates rather than make a choice in December was not an easy one, but we were not willing to go for a candidate who was missing too many of our desired characteristics/skills. This is something that the transition team does, and its not something that translates well to a table on meta.

I am not sure what you are referring to as “avoid another fiasco”, but as far as I am concerned we are simply in a stage of finding new candidates and trying to surface the candidate that is up to the challenge and opportunity that we as a unique movement have to offer. This was always an option, and we would have liked to have found someone in the first round, but it wasn’t to be.

Jan-Bart de Vreede



On 18 Jan 2014, at 11:08, Federico Leva (Nemo) <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I don't know what to think about a final community consultation on a specific name. Personally I suspect that I wouldn't be able to say anything about it, as with <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Executive_Director_Transition_Team/Update_9_December>.
> Speaking of which, I wonder how the problems there were addressed: apparently they just expanded the search and reduced the number of people participating, but I see no answers to the question: «Have we been looking for a unicorn -- somebody who doesn't exist in the real world? [...] too insular? [...] unfairly comparing [...]?».
> If an answer was found, I'd like to know it. To me that only looked like a rhetorical question, because of course I have no idea what exact criteria/questions/interview practices are being applied or if unfair comparisons were made. To avoid another fiasco, it would probably be useful to publish on Meta an anonymised table of candidates, pointing out strengths and weaknesses in a single line for each. Then one could say «oh, look, "criterion" 175 made 12 otherwise awesome candidates "fail", do we really need it?».
>
> Nemo
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Ziko van Dijk-2
Hello,

I would also prefer to avoid an expression such as "fiasco". Having not
found a candidate in 2013 was unpleasant, unfortunate, undesirable...

Kind regards
Ziko


Am Dienstag, 21. Januar 2014 schrieb Jan-Bart de Vreede :

> Hey Frederico
>
> I will write an update for the meta page in the coming week or so but just
> to give you a general sense of where we are at: we are trying to reach
> potential candidates in a different way, and so far that looks like a good
> strategy. This means more direct contact between the Foundation and
> candidates and more pro-actively reaching out to people who initially
> showed no interest.
>
> There is no scientific way to make the trade-off between
> characteristics/skills of candidates. We might very well choose to ignore
> an important characteristic if all the others fall into place. And it is of
> course easier to make a trade-off on less significant characteristics and
> skills. The decision to look for more candidates rather than make a choice
> in December was not an easy one, but we were not willing to go for a
> candidate who was missing too many of our desired characteristics/skills.
> This is something that the transition team does, and its not something that
> translates well to a table on meta.
>
> I am not sure what you are referring to as “avoid another fiasco”, but as
> far as I am concerned we are simply in a stage of finding new candidates
> and trying to surface the candidate that is up to the challenge and
> opportunity that we as a unique movement have to offer. This was always an
> option, and we would have liked to have found someone in the first round,
> but it wasn’t to be.
>
> Jan-Bart de Vreede
>
>
>
> On 18 Jan 2014, at 11:08, Federico Leva (Nemo) <[hidden email]<javascript:;>>
> wrote:
>
> > I don't know what to think about a final community consultation on a
> specific name. Personally I suspect that I wouldn't be able to say anything
> about it, as with <
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Executive_Director_Transition_Team/Update_9_December
> >.
> >       Speaking of which, I wonder how the problems there were addressed:
> apparently they just expanded the search and reduced the number of people
> participating, but I see no answers to the question: «Have we been looking
> for a unicorn -- somebody who doesn't exist in the real world? [...] too
> insular? [...] unfairly comparing [...]?».
> >       If an answer was found, I'd like to know it. To me that only
> looked like a rhetorical question, because of course I have no idea what
> exact criteria/questions/interview practices are being applied or if unfair
> comparisons were made. To avoid another fiasco, it would probably be useful
> to publish on Meta an anonymised table of candidates, pointing out
> strengths and weaknesses in a single line for each. Then one could say «oh,
> look, "criterion" 175 made 12 otherwise awesome candidates "fail", do we
> really need it?».
> >
> > Nemo
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list
> > [hidden email] <javascript:;>
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email] <javascript:;>
> ?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email] <javascript:;>
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email] <javascript:;>
> ?subject=unsubscribe>



--

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Dr. Ziko van Dijk
voorzitter / president Wikimedia Nederland

Vereniging Wikimedia Nederland
Postbus 167
3500 AD Utrecht
http://wikimedia.nl
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Craig Franklin
In reply to this post by Jan-Bart de Vreede-3
Hi Jan-Bart,

I was unaware that the panel had gone back to the drawing board with
looking at new candidates.  I gather from the tenor of Sue's original
posting that she was planning to have moved on by now, has she committed to
continuing to work on for the forseeable future while you continue to look
for a replacement?  Does the BoT have a contingency plan in case Sue does
decide to leave before a permanent replacement is found?

Cheers,
Craig Franklin


On 21 January 2014 21:09, Jan-Bart de Vreede <[hidden email]>wrote:

> Hey Frederico
>
> I will write an update for the meta page in the coming week or so but just
> to give you a general sense of where we are at: we are trying to reach
> potential candidates in a different way, and so far that looks like a good
> strategy. This means more direct contact between the Foundation and
> candidates and more pro-actively reaching out to people who initially
> showed no interest.
>
> There is no scientific way to make the trade-off between
> characteristics/skills of candidates. We might very well choose to ignore
> an important characteristic if all the others fall into place. And it is of
> course easier to make a trade-off on less significant characteristics and
> skills. The decision to look for more candidates rather than make a choice
> in December was not an easy one, but we were not willing to go for a
> candidate who was missing too many of our desired characteristics/skills.
> This is something that the transition team does, and its not something that
> translates well to a table on meta.
>
> I am not sure what you are referring to as “avoid another fiasco”, but as
> far as I am concerned we are simply in a stage of finding new candidates
> and trying to surface the candidate that is up to the challenge and
> opportunity that we as a unique movement have to offer. This was always an
> option, and we would have liked to have found someone in the first round,
> but it wasn’t to be.
>
> Jan-Bart de Vreede
>
>
>
> On 18 Jan 2014, at 11:08, Federico Leva (Nemo) <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > I don't know what to think about a final community consultation on a
> specific name. Personally I suspect that I wouldn't be able to say anything
> about it, as with <
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Executive_Director_Transition_Team/Update_9_December
> >.
> >       Speaking of which, I wonder how the problems there were addressed:
> apparently they just expanded the search and reduced the number of people
> participating, but I see no answers to the question: «Have we been looking
> for a unicorn -- somebody who doesn't exist in the real world? [...] too
> insular? [...] unfairly comparing [...]?».
> >       If an answer was found, I'd like to know it. To me that only
> looked like a rhetorical question, because of course I have no idea what
> exact criteria/questions/interview practices are being applied or if unfair
> comparisons were made. To avoid another fiasco, it would probably be useful
> to publish on Meta an anonymised table of candidates, pointing out
> strengths and weaknesses in a single line for each. Then one could say «oh,
> look, "criterion" 175 made 12 otherwise awesome candidates "fail", do we
> really need it?».
> >
> > Nemo
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Katie Chan
On 21/01/2014 12:08, Craig Franklin wrote:

> Hi Jan-Bart,
>
> I was unaware that the panel had gone back to the drawing board with
> looking at new candidates.  I gather from the tenor of Sue's original
> posting that she was planning to have moved on by now, has she committed to
> continuing to work on for the forseeable future while you continue to look
> for a replacement?  Does the BoT have a contingency plan in case Sue does
> decide to leave before a permanent replacement is found?
>
>

<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Executive_Director_Transition_Team/Update_9_December>

"Fortunately, Sue's reconfirmed with me that she's willing to stay on
until the search reaches a successful conclusion, which means we have
the luxury of time."

--
Katie Chan
Any views or opinions presented in this e-mail are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent the view of any organisation the author is associated with or employed by.


Experience is a good school but the fees are high.
      - Heinrich Heine


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

MZMcBride-2
In reply to this post by Jan-Bart de Vreede-3
Thanks for getting back to me.

Jan-Bart de Vreede wrote:
>There is no "community consultation" period in the selection proces. It's
>simply not feasible or desirable to have someone have a public "vetting"
>phase.

I'm not sure I understand how it would be infeasible. It's 2014, not 1814.
I think we've figured out how to solicit feedback in a timely manner.

It seems less desirable to me to reduce the Wikimedia community to waiting
for the white smoke.

The new Executive Director will be publicly vetted, to be sure, it just
sounds as though it'll happen after or he or she has been firmly appointed
by the Board. It would be dishonest to suggest that there's no merit to
this approach, but I do wonder if it's in line with Wikimedia's values.

>The good news is that you elected representatives on the board who
>have a strong voice in the selection process and final approval.

I'm not quite sure who "you" is, but only three of ten Board seats are
directly elected. I suppose that's a strong voice?

MZMcBride



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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Federico Leva (Nemo)
In reply to this post by Jan-Bart de Vreede-3
Thanks Jan-Bart for the answer.

Jan-Bart de Vreede, 21/01/2014 12:09:
> [...] I am not sure what you are referring to as “avoid another fiasco”, [...]

Sorry, I'll clarify: it would be a "fiasco" (only) if you had the same
result again. I was just aiming for a summary of the previous and
current situation in your own view.
        So if I summarise correctly: the answer to "Have we been looking for a
unicorn -- somebody who doesn't exist in the real world?" is no, "too
insular?" maybe, "unfairly comparing" no idea. Or, in other words, you
keep looking for the same thing but in a different way, which seems to
work better. Correct? You can answer in that update next week, no hurry.

Nemo

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Jan-Bart de Vreede-3
In reply to this post by MZMcBride-2
Hey

I am sure it is technically feasible, its just not realistic from a hiring perspective. I cannot tell a potential candidate that process includes a public vetting process, this is something that is just not going to happen. We are hiring an ED for the Wikimedia Foundation, and the Board of Trustees of that Foundation is simply the body that is responsible for the final decision on this.  

I am not going to debate the different kinds of movement representation in the board, but I would argue that the community directly and indirectly influences 100% of the board, as appointed members are appointed by (s)elected members and the founder of the Wikimedia Foundation.

Jan-Bart



On 21 Jan 2014, at 15:57, MZMcBride <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Thanks for getting back to me.
>
> Jan-Bart de Vreede wrote:
>> There is no "community consultation" period in the selection proces. It's
>> simply not feasible or desirable to have someone have a public "vetting"
>> phase.
>
> I'm not sure I understand how it would be infeasible. It's 2014, not 1814.
> I think we've figured out how to solicit feedback in a timely manner.
>
> It seems less desirable to me to reduce the Wikimedia community to waiting
> for the white smoke.
>
> The new Executive Director will be publicly vetted, to be sure, it just
> sounds as though it'll happen after or he or she has been firmly appointed
> by the Board. It would be dishonest to suggest that there's no merit to
> this approach, but I do wonder if it's in line with Wikimedia's values.
>
>> The good news is that you elected representatives on the board who
>> have a strong voice in the selection process and final approval.
>
> I'm not quite sure who "you" is, but only three of ten Board seats are
> directly elected. I suppose that's a strong voice?
>
> MZMcBride
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Dariusz Jemielniak-3
I have to say that much as I would like to have the opportunity for us, as
the community, to participate in the process, I understand that this could
likely deter many quality people from applying (and we don't want only
those who are currently between jobs, right?).

best,

dariusz "pundit"


On Tue, Jan 21, 2014 at 6:28 PM, Jan-Bart de Vreede <[hidden email]
> wrote:

> Hey
>
> I am sure it is technically feasible, its just not realistic from a hiring
> perspective. I cannot tell a potential candidate that process includes a
> public vetting process, this is something that is just not going to happen.
> We are hiring an ED for the Wikimedia Foundation, and the Board of Trustees
> of that Foundation is simply the body that is responsible for the final
> decision on this.
>
> I am not going to debate the different kinds of movement representation in
> the board, but I would argue that the community directly and indirectly
> influences 100% of the board, as appointed members are appointed by
> (s)elected members and the founder of the Wikimedia Foundation.
>
> Jan-Bart
>
>
>
> On 21 Jan 2014, at 15:57, MZMcBride <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Thanks for getting back to me.
> >
> > Jan-Bart de Vreede wrote:
> >> There is no "community consultation" period in the selection proces.
> It's
> >> simply not feasible or desirable to have someone have a public "vetting"
> >> phase.
> >
> > I'm not sure I understand how it would be infeasible. It's 2014, not
> 1814.
> > I think we've figured out how to solicit feedback in a timely manner.
> >
> > It seems less desirable to me to reduce the Wikimedia community to
> waiting
> > for the white smoke.
> >
> > The new Executive Director will be publicly vetted, to be sure, it just
> > sounds as though it'll happen after or he or she has been firmly
> appointed
> > by the Board. It would be dishonest to suggest that there's no merit to
> > this approach, but I do wonder if it's in line with Wikimedia's values.
> >
> >> The good news is that you elected representatives on the board who
> >> have a strong voice in the selection process and final approval.
> >
> > I'm not quite sure who "you" is, but only three of ten Board seats are
> > directly elected. I suppose that's a strong voice?
> >
> > MZMcBride
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>



--

__________________________
dr hab. Dariusz Jemielniak
profesor zarządzania
kierownik katedry Zarządzania Międzynarodowego
i centrum badawczego CROW
Akademia Leona Koźmińskiego
http://www.crow.alk.edu.pl
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

James Salsman-2
In reply to this post by MZMcBride-2
Jan-Bart de Vreede wrote:
>...
> we are trying to reach potential candidates in a different way....

Does Leonie Haimson want to interview to be co-director?
http://www.classsizematters.org/about-us/

She started editing in the past year, after suffering from a paid
advocacy-introduced inaccuracy contrary to the peer reviewed secondary
literature, many examples of which still exist in the English
Wikipedia.

Best regards,
James Salsman

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Strainu
In reply to this post by Jan-Bart de Vreede-3
2014/1/21 Jan-Bart de Vreede <[hidden email]>:
> I am not going to debate the different kinds of movement representation in the board, but I would argue that the community directly and indirectly influences 100% of the board, as appointed members are appointed by (s)elected members and the founder of the Wikimedia Foundation.

What a bad joke... What does the community have to do with the
founder's seat (10% of the board)? And the members chosen by the board
itself (40%) have time and again shown that, despite their good faith
and best efforts, their understanding of the inner workings of the
community is scarce at best. I reckon (without any proof though) that
this distribution of seats is at least in part responsible for the
alienation between the Foundation and the community in 2009-2012.

Strainu

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Gerard Meijssen-3
In reply to this post by James Salsman-2
Hoi,
Sorry I cannot parse this " suffering from a paid advocacy-introduced
inaccuracy contrary to the peer reviewed secondary literature"
Thanks,
     GerardM


On 22 January 2014 11:29, James Salsman <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Jan-Bart de Vreede wrote:
> >...
> > we are trying to reach potential candidates in a different way....
>
> Does Leonie Haimson want to interview to be co-director?
> http://www.classsizematters.org/about-us/
>
> She started editing in the past year, after suffering from a paid
> advocacy-introduced inaccuracy contrary to the peer reviewed secondary
> literature, many examples of which still exist in the English
> Wikipedia.
>
> Best regards,
> James Salsman
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Fæ
In reply to this post by Jan-Bart de Vreede-3
Thanks for the assurance that the community "directly and indirectly
influences 100% of the board".

Could someone point me to where this happened for the founder of the
Wikimedia Foundation?

Thanks again,
Fae

On 21 January 2014 17:28, Jan-Bart de Vreede <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hey
>
> I am sure it is technically feasible, its just not realistic from a hiring perspective. I cannot tell a potential candidate that process includes a public vetting process, this is something that is just not going to happen. We are hiring an ED for the Wikimedia Foundation, and the Board of Trustees of that Foundation is simply the body that is responsible for the final decision on this.
>
> I am not going to debate the different kinds of movement representation in the board, but I would argue that the community directly and indirectly influences 100% of the board, as appointed members are appointed by (s)elected members and the founder of the Wikimedia Foundation.
>
> Jan-Bart
>
>
>
> On 21 Jan 2014, at 15:57, MZMcBride <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> Thanks for getting back to me.
>>
>> Jan-Bart de Vreede wrote:
>>> There is no "community consultation" period in the selection proces. It's
>>> simply not feasible or desirable to have someone have a public "vetting"
>>> phase.
>>
>> I'm not sure I understand how it would be infeasible. It's 2014, not 1814.
>> I think we've figured out how to solicit feedback in a timely manner.
>>
>> It seems less desirable to me to reduce the Wikimedia community to waiting
>> for the white smoke.
>>
>> The new Executive Director will be publicly vetted, to be sure, it just
>> sounds as though it'll happen after or he or she has been firmly appointed
>> by the Board. It would be dishonest to suggest that there's no merit to
>> this approach, but I do wonder if it's in line with Wikimedia's values.
>>
>>> The good news is that you elected representatives on the board who
>>> have a strong voice in the selection process and final approval.
>>
>> I'm not quite sure who "you" is, but only three of ten Board seats are
>> directly elected. I suppose that's a strong voice?
>>
>> MZMcBride
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>



--
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Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Jeevan Jose
Founder of the Wikimedia Foundation = One who founded/established the
foundation? Sorry; I didn't get your question.

Regards,
Jee


On Wed, Jan 22, 2014 at 4:30 PM, Fæ <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Thanks for the assurance that the community "directly and indirectly
> influences 100% of the board".
>
> Could someone point me to where this happened for the founder of the
> Wikimedia Foundation?
>
> Thanks again,
> Fae
>
> On 21 January 2014 17:28, Jan-Bart de Vreede <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> > Hey
> >
> > I am sure it is technically feasible, its just not realistic from a
> hiring perspective. I cannot tell a potential candidate that process
> includes a public vetting process, this is something that is just not going
> to happen. We are hiring an ED for the Wikimedia Foundation, and the Board
> of Trustees of that Foundation is simply the body that is responsible for
> the final decision on this.
> >
> > I am not going to debate the different kinds of movement representation
> in the board, but I would argue that the community directly and indirectly
> influences 100% of the board, as appointed members are appointed by
> (s)elected members and the founder of the Wikimedia Foundation.
> >
> > Jan-Bart
> >
> >
> >
> > On 21 Jan 2014, at 15:57, MZMcBride <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> >> Thanks for getting back to me.
> >>
> >> Jan-Bart de Vreede wrote:
> >>> There is no "community consultation" period in the selection proces.
> It's
> >>> simply not feasible or desirable to have someone have a public
> "vetting"
> >>> phase.
> >>
> >> I'm not sure I understand how it would be infeasible. It's 2014, not
> 1814.
> >> I think we've figured out how to solicit feedback in a timely manner.
> >>
> >> It seems less desirable to me to reduce the Wikimedia community to
> waiting
> >> for the white smoke.
> >>
> >> The new Executive Director will be publicly vetted, to be sure, it just
> >> sounds as though it'll happen after or he or she has been firmly
> appointed
> >> by the Board. It would be dishonest to suggest that there's no merit to
> >> this approach, but I do wonder if it's in line with Wikimedia's values.
> >>
> >>> The good news is that you elected representatives on the board who
> >>> have a strong voice in the selection process and final approval.
> >>
> >> I'm not quite sure who "you" is, but only three of ten Board seats are
> >> directly elected. I suppose that's a strong voice?
> >>
> >> MZMcBride
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> >> [hidden email]
> >> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
>
> --
> [hidden email] http://j.mp/faewm
> Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote.
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

James Salsman-2
In reply to this post by James Salsman-2
GerardM, please see:
http://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Class-size_reduction&diff=563977349&oldid=405118703

...for starters. The editor from 2010 is a strident charter schools
movement proponent who strongly prefers parochial education to public
education in the U.S., which is a surprisingly common view among Stanford's
Hoover Institution-sponsored staff, their relatives, and alumni. See also
the proportion of Americans who disbelieve evolution, vaccines, and
radioisotope dating.

Best regards,
James Salsman


On Wednesday, January 22, 2014, James Salsman <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Jan-Bart de Vreede wrote:
> >...
> > we are trying to reach potential candidates in a different way....
>
> Does Leonie Haimson want to interview to be co-director?
> http://www.classsizematters.org/about-us/
>
> She started editing in the past year, after suffering from a paid
> advocacy-introduced inaccuracy contrary to the peer reviewed secondary
> literature, many examples of which still exist in the English
> Wikipedia.
>
> Best regards,
> James Salsman
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Luiz Augusto-2
In reply to this post by Jeevan Jose
Founder of a company that hosted the first wiki setup named as Wikipedia
after someone else suggested it due to the failure of Nupedia.

There is currently a Foundation where he is limited to the boy who
sometimes talks to the press only after YEARS of internal wars, including
press coverage of he misusing the Foundation credit card.

You should learn more about the Wikimedia history...
Em 22/01/2014 09:43, "Jeevan Jose" <[hidden email]> escreveu:

> Founder of the Wikimedia Foundation = One who founded/established the
> foundation? Sorry; I didn't get your question.
>
> Regards,
> Jee
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 22, 2014 at 4:30 PM, Fæ <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Thanks for the assurance that the community "directly and indirectly
> > influences 100% of the board".
> >
> > Could someone point me to where this happened for the founder of the
> > Wikimedia Foundation?
> >
> > Thanks again,
> > Fae
> >
> > On 21 January 2014 17:28, Jan-Bart de Vreede <[hidden email]>
> > wrote:
> > > Hey
> > >
> > > I am sure it is technically feasible, its just not realistic from a
> > hiring perspective. I cannot tell a potential candidate that process
> > includes a public vetting process, this is something that is just not
> going
> > to happen. We are hiring an ED for the Wikimedia Foundation, and the
> Board
> > of Trustees of that Foundation is simply the body that is responsible for
> > the final decision on this.
> > >
> > > I am not going to debate the different kinds of movement representation
> > in the board, but I would argue that the community directly and
> indirectly
> > influences 100% of the board, as appointed members are appointed by
> > (s)elected members and the founder of the Wikimedia Foundation.
> > >
> > > Jan-Bart
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > On 21 Jan 2014, at 15:57, MZMcBride <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > >
> > >> Thanks for getting back to me.
> > >>
> > >> Jan-Bart de Vreede wrote:
> > >>> There is no "community consultation" period in the selection proces.
> > It's
> > >>> simply not feasible or desirable to have someone have a public
> > "vetting"
> > >>> phase.
> > >>
> > >> I'm not sure I understand how it would be infeasible. It's 2014, not
> > 1814.
> > >> I think we've figured out how to solicit feedback in a timely manner.
> > >>
> > >> It seems less desirable to me to reduce the Wikimedia community to
> > waiting
> > >> for the white smoke.
> > >>
> > >> The new Executive Director will be publicly vetted, to be sure, it
> just
> > >> sounds as though it'll happen after or he or she has been firmly
> > appointed
> > >> by the Board. It would be dishonest to suggest that there's no merit
> to
> > >> this approach, but I do wonder if it's in line with Wikimedia's
> values.
> > >>
> > >>> The good news is that you elected representatives on the board who
> > >>> have a strong voice in the selection process and final approval.
> > >>
> > >> I'm not quite sure who "you" is, but only three of ten Board seats are
> > >> directly elected. I suppose that's a strong voice?
> > >>
> > >> MZMcBride
> > >>
> > >>
> > >>
> > >> _______________________________________________
> > >> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> > >> [hidden email]
> > >> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
> ,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list
> > > [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > [hidden email] http://j.mp/faewm
> > Personal and confidential, please do not circulate or re-quote.
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Katie Chan
Oh for heavens sake, what does that have anything to do with this thread?

--
Katie Chan
Any views or opinions presented in this e-mail are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent the view of any organisation the author is associated with or employed by.


Experience is a good school but the fees are high.
      - Heinrich Heine


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Community consultation + Wikimedia Foundation Executive Director selection process

Luiz Augusto-2
The 100% being reduced to at least 90% but, in fact, my wording was
friendly to start a flame war. Sorry for that.
Em 22/01/2014 11:27, "Katie Chan" <[hidden email]> escreveu:

> Oh for heavens sake, what does that have anything to do with this thread?
>
> --
> Katie Chan
> Any views or opinions presented in this e-mail are solely those of the
> author and do not necessarily represent the view of any organisation the
> author is associated with or employed by.
>
>
> Experience is a good school but the fees are high.
>      - Heinrich Heine
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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123