[Wikimedia-l] Experimental onion service for all Wikimedia projects set up by Alec Muffett

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[Wikimedia-l] Experimental onion service for all Wikimedia projects set up by Alec Muffett

Cristian Consonni-3
Hi all,

Some months ago, the idea of setting up an onion service for Wikimedia
projects was discussed on this list[1] and as a proposal in IdeaLab on
Meta[2].

Today, Alec Muffett announced on Twitter[3] that he created «as an
experiment» a series of read-only mirrors of all the Wikimedia projects.
He will be running them for some time.

The service is reachable with a Tor-enabled browser at the following
address:
https://www.qgssno7jk2xcr2sj.onion/
































If you want to try out the service, first visit the addresses listed in
this page and add exceptions for the SSL certificates:
https://gist.github.com/alecmuffett/3da587fde6aef90ba3e49e8858fafdae

(this is one of the limits of having a non-official service)

Alec Muffett is the author of the Enterprise Onion Toolkit (EOTK)[4], a
FLOSS project which "does for Onions what LetsEncrypt does for SSL",
that is providing a simple way to transform websites in Onion services
(which are accessible only and contained within the Tor network). Alec
used EOTK for creating this demo. He was also behind the onion service
for Facebook[5].

IMO this service, even with its current limitations, is quite awesome
and I am very happy to see it. It is exactly the kind of proof of
concept that I wanted to create with my proposal. So now there's that.

Enjoy!

Cristian

[1]: https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2017-June/087708.html
[2]:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IdeaLab/A_Tor_Onion_Service_for_Wikipedia
[3]:https://twitter.com/AlecMuffett/status/933739816038076419
[4]: https://github.com/alecmuffett/eotk
[5]:
https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/10/facebook-offers-hidden-service-to-tor-users/

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Experimental onion service for all Wikimedia projects set up by Alec Muffett

Dariusz Jemielniak-3
Excellent! Still, as I argued before, I believe that a solution we could
use is defaulting to Tor channeling in our mobile app. Facebook offers it
as an option in partnership with Orbot - I believe we should do the same,
but default to it (so that people cannot be held responsible for making a
choice). For unlogged Wikipedia reading this solution is practically
transparent for users.

I've recently contacted the WMF with Orbot people and hope that at least we
can evaluate this approach as a possibility.

best,

Dariusz Jemielniak "pundit"



On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 2:11 AM, Cristian Consonni <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> Some months ago, the idea of setting up an onion service for Wikimedia
> projects was discussed on this list[1] and as a proposal in IdeaLab on
> Meta[2].
>
> Today, Alec Muffett announced on Twitter[3] that he created «as an
> experiment» a series of read-only mirrors of all the Wikimedia projects.
> He will be running them for some time.
>
> The service is reachable with a Tor-enabled browser at the following
> address:
> https://www.qgssno7jk2xcr2sj.onion/
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> If you want to try out the service, first visit the addresses listed in
> this page and add exceptions for the SSL certificates:
> https://gist.github.com/alecmuffett/3da587fde6aef90ba3e49e8858fafdae
>
> (this is one of the limits of having a non-official service)
>
> Alec Muffett is the author of the Enterprise Onion Toolkit (EOTK)[4], a
> FLOSS project which "does for Onions what LetsEncrypt does for SSL",
> that is providing a simple way to transform websites in Onion services
> (which are accessible only and contained within the Tor network). Alec
> used EOTK for creating this demo. He was also behind the onion service
> for Facebook[5].
>
> IMO this service, even with its current limitations, is quite awesome
> and I am very happy to see it. It is exactly the kind of proof of
> concept that I wanted to create with my proposal. So now there's that.
>
> Enjoy!
>
> Cristian
>
> [1]: https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2017-
> June/087708.html
> [2]:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IdeaLab/A_Tor_
> Onion_Service_for_Wikipedia
> [3]:https://twitter.com/AlecMuffett/status/933739816038076419
> [4]: https://github.com/alecmuffett/eotk
> [5]:
> https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/
> 10/facebook-offers-hidden-service-to-tor-users/
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/
> wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/
> wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>




--
________________________________________________________
<http://nerds.kozminski.edu.pl/> prof. dr hab. Dariusz Jemielniak
kierownik katedry MINDS (Management in Networked and Digital Societies)
Akademia Leona Koźmińskiego
http://NeRDS.kozminski.edu.pl  <http://nerds.kozminski.edu.pl/>

associate faculty w Berkman-Klein Center for Internet and Society,
Harvard University
*Ostatnie artykuły:*

   - Dariusz Jemielniak, Maciej Wilamowski (2017)  Cultural Diversity of
   Quality of Information on Wikipedias
   <http://crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/cultures%20of%20wikipedias.pdf>
*Journal
   of the Association for Information Science and Technology* 68:  10.
    2460–2470.
   - Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Wikimedia Movement Governance: The Limits
   of A-Hierarchical Organization
   <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/wikimedia_governance.pdf> *Journal
   of Organizational Change Management *29:  3.  361-378.
   - Dariusz Jemielniak, Eduard Aibar (2016)  Bridging the Gap Between
   Wikipedia and Academia
   <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/bridging.pdf> *Journal of the
   Association for Information Science and Technology* 67:  7.  1773-1776.
   - Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Breaking the Glass Ceiling on Wikipedia
   <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/glass-ceiling.pdf> *Feminist
   Review *113:  1.  103-108.
   - Tadeusz Chełkowski, Peter Gloor, Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Inequalities
   in Open Source Software Development: Analysis of Contributor’s Commits in
   Apache Software Foundation Projects
   <http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/asset?id=10.1371%2Fjournal.pone.0152976.PDF>
   , *PLoS ONE* 11:  4.  e0152976.
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: [hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Experimental onion service for all Wikimedia projects set up by Alec Muffett

metasj
Seconded -- this is an excellent use of Orbot. Worth testing that
experience to see if it could be a comfortable default.

On Nov 24, 2017 3:36 AM, "Dariusz Jemielniak" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Excellent! Still, as I argued before, I believe that a solution we could
> use is defaulting to Tor channeling in our mobile app. Facebook offers it
> as an option in partnership with Orbot - I believe we should do the same,
> but default to it (so that people cannot be held responsible for making a
> choice). For unlogged Wikipedia reading this solution is practically
> transparent for users.
>
> I've recently contacted the WMF with Orbot people and hope that at least we
> can evaluate this approach as a possibility.
>
> best,
>
> Dariusz Jemielniak "pundit"
>
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 2:11 AM, Cristian Consonni <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Some months ago, the idea of setting up an onion service for Wikimedia
> > projects was discussed on this list[1] and as a proposal in IdeaLab on
> > Meta[2].
> >
> > Today, Alec Muffett announced on Twitter[3] that he created «as an
> > experiment» a series of read-only mirrors of all the Wikimedia projects.
> > He will be running them for some time.
> >
> > The service is reachable with a Tor-enabled browser at the following
> > address:
> > https://www.qgssno7jk2xcr2sj.onion/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > If you want to try out the service, first visit the addresses listed in
> > this page and add exceptions for the SSL certificates:
> > https://gist.github.com/alecmuffett/3da587fde6aef90ba3e49e8858fafdae
> >
> > (this is one of the limits of having a non-official service)
> >
> > Alec Muffett is the author of the Enterprise Onion Toolkit (EOTK)[4], a
> > FLOSS project which "does for Onions what LetsEncrypt does for SSL",
> > that is providing a simple way to transform websites in Onion services
> > (which are accessible only and contained within the Tor network). Alec
> > used EOTK for creating this demo. He was also behind the onion service
> > for Facebook[5].
> >
> > IMO this service, even with its current limitations, is quite awesome
> > and I am very happy to see it. It is exactly the kind of proof of
> > concept that I wanted to create with my proposal. So now there's that.
> >
> > Enjoy!
> >
> > Cristian
> >
> > [1]: https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2017-
> > June/087708.html
> > [2]:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IdeaLab/A_Tor_
> > Onion_Service_for_Wikipedia
> > [3]:https://twitter.com/AlecMuffett/status/933739816038076419
> > [4]: https://github.com/alecmuffett/eotk
> > [5]:
> > https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/
> > 10/facebook-offers-hidden-service-to-tor-users/
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/
> > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/
> > wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
>
>
> --
> ________________________________________________________
> <http://nerds.kozminski.edu.pl/> prof. dr hab. Dariusz Jemielniak
> kierownik katedry MINDS (Management in Networked and Digital Societies)
> Akademia Leona Koźmińskiego
> http://NeRDS.kozminski.edu.pl  <http://nerds.kozminski.edu.pl/>
>
> associate faculty w Berkman-Klein Center for Internet and Society,
> Harvard University
> *Ostatnie artykuły:*
>
>    - Dariusz Jemielniak, Maciej Wilamowski (2017)  Cultural Diversity of
>    Quality of Information on Wikipedias
>    <http://crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/cultures%20of%20wikipedias.pdf>
> *Journal
>    of the Association for Information Science and Technology* 68:  10.
>     2460–2470.
>    - Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Wikimedia Movement Governance: The Limits
>    of A-Hierarchical Organization
>    <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/wikimedia_governance.pdf>
> *Journal
>    of Organizational Change Management *29:  3.  361-378.
>    - Dariusz Jemielniak, Eduard Aibar (2016)  Bridging the Gap Between
>    Wikipedia and Academia
>    <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/bridging.pdf> *Journal of the
>    Association for Information Science and Technology* 67:  7.  1773-1776.
>    - Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Breaking the Glass Ceiling on Wikipedia
>    <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/glass-ceiling.pdf> *Feminist
>    Review *113:  1.  103-108.
>    - Tadeusz Chełkowski, Peter Gloor, Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)
> Inequalities
>    in Open Source Software Development: Analysis of Contributor’s Commits
> in
>    Apache Software Foundation Projects
>    <http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/asset?id=10.
> 1371%2Fjournal.pone.0152976.PDF>
>    , *PLoS ONE* 11:  4.  e0152976.
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/
> wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/
> wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
New messages to: [hidden email]
Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Experimental onion service for all Wikimedia projects set up by Alec Muffett

Tilman Bayer
In reply to this post by Dariusz Jemielniak-3
I think this is unlikely to happen, because of the performance degradation
(access via Tor will always be slower, which user studies
<http://www.mdpi.com/1999-5903/4/2/488/htm> have shown to be a significant
usability issue in the past). But as an option or fallback or separate app
it might be a great idea; there is a Phabricator task at
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T163747

On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 12:35 AM, Dariusz Jemielniak <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Excellent! Still, as I argued before, I believe that a solution we could
> use is defaulting to Tor channeling in our mobile app. Facebook offers it
> as an option in partnership with Orbot - I believe we should do the same,
> but default to it (so that people cannot be held responsible for making a
> choice). For unlogged Wikipedia reading this solution is practically
> transparent for users.
>
> I've recently contacted the WMF with Orbot people and hope that at least we
> can evaluate this approach as a possibility.
>
> best,
>
> Dariusz Jemielniak "pundit"
>
>
>
> On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 2:11 AM, Cristian Consonni <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > Some months ago, the idea of setting up an onion service for Wikimedia
> > projects was discussed on this list[1] and as a proposal in IdeaLab on
> > Meta[2].
> >
> > Today, Alec Muffett announced on Twitter[3] that he created «as an
> > experiment» a series of read-only mirrors of all the Wikimedia projects.
> > He will be running them for some time.
> >
> > The service is reachable with a Tor-enabled browser at the following
> > address:
> > https://www.qgssno7jk2xcr2sj.onion/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > If you want to try out the service, first visit the addresses listed in
> > this page and add exceptions for the SSL certificates:
> > https://gist.github.com/alecmuffett/3da587fde6aef90ba3e49e8858fafdae
> >
> > (this is one of the limits of having a non-official service)
> >
> > Alec Muffett is the author of the Enterprise Onion Toolkit (EOTK)[4], a
> > FLOSS project which "does for Onions what LetsEncrypt does for SSL",
> > that is providing a simple way to transform websites in Onion services
> > (which are accessible only and contained within the Tor network). Alec
> > used EOTK for creating this demo. He was also behind the onion service
> > for Facebook[5].
> >
> > IMO this service, even with its current limitations, is quite awesome
> > and I am very happy to see it. It is exactly the kind of proof of
> > concept that I wanted to create with my proposal. So now there's that.
> >
> > Enjoy!
> >
> > Cristian
> >
> > [1]: https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2017-
> > June/087708.html
> > [2]:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IdeaLab/A_Tor_
> > Onion_Service_for_Wikipedia
> > [3]:https://twitter.com/AlecMuffett/status/933739816038076419
> > [4]: https://github.com/alecmuffett/eotk
> > [5]:
> > https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/
> > 10/facebook-offers-hidden-service-to-tor-users/
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/
> > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/
> > wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
>
>
> --
> ________________________________________________________
> <http://nerds.kozminski.edu.pl/> prof. dr hab. Dariusz Jemielniak
> kierownik katedry MINDS (Management in Networked and Digital Societies)
> Akademia Leona Koźmińskiego
> http://NeRDS.kozminski.edu.pl  <http://nerds.kozminski.edu.pl/>
>
> associate faculty w Berkman-Klein Center for Internet and Society,
> Harvard University
> *Ostatnie artykuły:*
>
>    - Dariusz Jemielniak, Maciej Wilamowski (2017)  Cultural Diversity of
>    Quality of Information on Wikipedias
>    <http://crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/cultures%20of%20wikipedias.pdf>
> *Journal
>    of the Association for Information Science and Technology* 68:  10.
>     2460–2470.
>    - Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Wikimedia Movement Governance: The Limits
>    of A-Hierarchical Organization
>    <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/wikimedia_governance.pdf>
> *Journal
>    of Organizational Change Management *29:  3.  361-378.
>    - Dariusz Jemielniak, Eduard Aibar (2016)  Bridging the Gap Between
>    Wikipedia and Academia
>    <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/bridging.pdf> *Journal of the
>    Association for Information Science and Technology* 67:  7.  1773-1776.
>    - Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Breaking the Glass Ceiling on Wikipedia
>    <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/glass-ceiling.pdf> *Feminist
>    Review *113:  1.  103-108.
>    - Tadeusz Chełkowski, Peter Gloor, Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)
> Inequalities
>    in Open Source Software Development: Analysis of Contributor’s Commits
> in
>    Apache Software Foundation Projects
>    <<a href="http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/asset?id=10.1371%">http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/asset?id=10.1371%
> 2Fjournal.pone.0152976.PDF>
>    , *PLoS ONE* 11:  4.  e0152976.
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik
> i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>



--
Tilman Bayer
Senior Analyst
Wikimedia Foundation
IRC (Freenode): HaeB
_______________________________________________
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Experimental onion service for all Wikimedia projects set up by Alec Muffett

mathieu lovato stumpf guntz
Then, if it's not a too big maintance burden, what about proposing both
solution?

Our users already pay extremely huge loading time for some feature like
visual editing, but the far faster wikitext editor is still there for
those who are happier with that.


Le 24/11/2017 à 19:37, Tilman Bayer a écrit :

> I think this is unlikely to happen, because of the performance degradation
> (access via Tor will always be slower, which user studies
> <http://www.mdpi.com/1999-5903/4/2/488/htm> have shown to be a significant
> usability issue in the past). But as an option or fallback or separate app
> it might be a great idea; there is a Phabricator task at
> https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T163747
>
> On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 12:35 AM, Dariusz Jemielniak <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
>> Excellent! Still, as I argued before, I believe that a solution we could
>> use is defaulting to Tor channeling in our mobile app. Facebook offers it
>> as an option in partnership with Orbot - I believe we should do the same,
>> but default to it (so that people cannot be held responsible for making a
>> choice). For unlogged Wikipedia reading this solution is practically
>> transparent for users.
>>
>> I've recently contacted the WMF with Orbot people and hope that at least we
>> can evaluate this approach as a possibility.
>>
>> best,
>>
>> Dariusz Jemielniak "pundit"
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 2:11 AM, Cristian Consonni <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Hi all,
>>>
>>> Some months ago, the idea of setting up an onion service for Wikimedia
>>> projects was discussed on this list[1] and as a proposal in IdeaLab on
>>> Meta[2].
>>>
>>> Today, Alec Muffett announced on Twitter[3] that he created «as an
>>> experiment» a series of read-only mirrors of all the Wikimedia projects.
>>> He will be running them for some time.
>>>
>>> The service is reachable with a Tor-enabled browser at the following
>>> address:
>>> https://www.qgssno7jk2xcr2sj.onion/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> If you want to try out the service, first visit the addresses listed in
>>> this page and add exceptions for the SSL certificates:
>>> https://gist.github.com/alecmuffett/3da587fde6aef90ba3e49e8858fafdae
>>>
>>> (this is one of the limits of having a non-official service)
>>>
>>> Alec Muffett is the author of the Enterprise Onion Toolkit (EOTK)[4], a
>>> FLOSS project which "does for Onions what LetsEncrypt does for SSL",
>>> that is providing a simple way to transform websites in Onion services
>>> (which are accessible only and contained within the Tor network). Alec
>>> used EOTK for creating this demo. He was also behind the onion service
>>> for Facebook[5].
>>>
>>> IMO this service, even with its current limitations, is quite awesome
>>> and I am very happy to see it. It is exactly the kind of proof of
>>> concept that I wanted to create with my proposal. So now there's that.
>>>
>>> Enjoy!
>>>
>>> Cristian
>>>
>>> [1]: https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2017-
>>> June/087708.html
>>> [2]:
>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IdeaLab/A_Tor_
>>> Onion_Service_for_Wikipedia
>>> [3]:https://twitter.com/AlecMuffett/status/933739816038076419
>>> [4]: https://github.com/alecmuffett/eotk
>>> [5]:
>>> https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/
>>> 10/facebook-offers-hidden-service-to-tor-users/
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/
>>> wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/
>>> wiki/Wikimedia-l
>>> New messages to: [hidden email]
>>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>>> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> ________________________________________________________
>> <http://nerds.kozminski.edu.pl/> prof. dr hab. Dariusz Jemielniak
>> kierownik katedry MINDS (Management in Networked and Digital Societies)
>> Akademia Leona Koźmińskiego
>> http://NeRDS.kozminski.edu.pl  <http://nerds.kozminski.edu.pl/>
>>
>> associate faculty w Berkman-Klein Center for Internet and Society,
>> Harvard University
>> *Ostatnie artykuły:*
>>
>>     - Dariusz Jemielniak, Maciej Wilamowski (2017)  Cultural Diversity of
>>     Quality of Information on Wikipedias
>>     <http://crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/cultures%20of%20wikipedias.pdf>
>> *Journal
>>     of the Association for Information Science and Technology* 68:  10.
>>      2460–2470.
>>     - Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Wikimedia Movement Governance: The Limits
>>     of A-Hierarchical Organization
>>     <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/wikimedia_governance.pdf>
>> *Journal
>>     of Organizational Change Management *29:  3.  361-378.
>>     - Dariusz Jemielniak, Eduard Aibar (2016)  Bridging the Gap Between
>>     Wikipedia and Academia
>>     <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/bridging.pdf> *Journal of the
>>     Association for Information Science and Technology* 67:  7.  1773-1776.
>>     - Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Breaking the Glass Ceiling on Wikipedia
>>     <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/glass-ceiling.pdf> *Feminist
>>     Review *113:  1.  103-108.
>>     - Tadeusz Chełkowski, Peter Gloor, Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)
>> Inequalities
>>     in Open Source Software Development: Analysis of Contributor’s Commits
>> in
>>     Apache Software Foundation Projects
>>     <<a href="http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/asset?id=10.1371%">http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/asset?id=10.1371%
>> 2Fjournal.pone.0152976.PDF>
>>     , *PLoS ONE* 11:  4.  e0152976.
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik
>> i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
>> New messages to: [hidden email]
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>
>

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Experimental onion service for all Wikimedia projects set up by Alec Muffett

Dariusz Jemielniak-3
In reply to this post by Tilman Bayer
Well, what we could do just as well is trying to load normally, but when it
fails immediately load through Orbot. The delays should be minimal most of
the time, and the crucial part is that
a) users don't have to do anything, install other apps, change the settings
- it just works,
b) users won't be held responsible for downloading a special app or making
a choice to use Tor.

Dj

On Nov 24, 2017 18:38, "Tilman Bayer" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I think this is unlikely to happen, because of the performance degradation
> (access via Tor will always be slower, which user studies
> <http://www.mdpi.com/1999-5903/4/2/488/htm> have shown to be a
> significant usability issue in the past). But as an option or fallback or
> separate app it might be a great idea; there is a Phabricator task at
> https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T163747
>
> On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 12:35 AM, Dariusz Jemielniak <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
>> Excellent! Still, as I argued before, I believe that a solution we could
>> use is defaulting to Tor channeling in our mobile app. Facebook offers it
>> as an option in partnership with Orbot - I believe we should do the same,
>> but default to it (so that people cannot be held responsible for making a
>> choice). For unlogged Wikipedia reading this solution is practically
>> transparent for users.
>>
>> I've recently contacted the WMF with Orbot people and hope that at least
>> we
>> can evaluate this approach as a possibility.
>>
>> best,
>>
>> Dariusz Jemielniak "pundit"
>>
>>
>>
>> On Fri, Nov 24, 2017 at 2:11 AM, Cristian Consonni <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Hi all,
>> >
>> > Some months ago, the idea of setting up an onion service for Wikimedia
>> > projects was discussed on this list[1] and as a proposal in IdeaLab on
>> > Meta[2].
>> >
>> > Today, Alec Muffett announced on Twitter[3] that he created «as an
>> > experiment» a series of read-only mirrors of all the Wikimedia projects.
>> > He will be running them for some time.
>> >
>> > The service is reachable with a Tor-enabled browser at the following
>> > address:
>> > https://www.qgssno7jk2xcr2sj.onion/
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> > If you want to try out the service, first visit the addresses listed in
>> > this page and add exceptions for the SSL certificates:
>> > https://gist.github.com/alecmuffett/3da587fde6aef90ba3e49e8858fafdae
>> >
>> > (this is one of the limits of having a non-official service)
>> >
>> > Alec Muffett is the author of the Enterprise Onion Toolkit (EOTK)[4], a
>> > FLOSS project which "does for Onions what LetsEncrypt does for SSL",
>> > that is providing a simple way to transform websites in Onion services
>> > (which are accessible only and contained within the Tor network). Alec
>> > used EOTK for creating this demo. He was also behind the onion service
>> > for Facebook[5].
>> >
>> > IMO this service, even with its current limitations, is quite awesome
>> > and I am very happy to see it. It is exactly the kind of proof of
>> > concept that I wanted to create with my proposal. So now there's that.
>> >
>> > Enjoy!
>> >
>> > Cristian
>> >
>> > [1]: https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2017-
>> > June/087708.html
>> > [2]:
>> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Grants:IdeaLab/A_Tor_
>> > Onion_Service_for_Wikipedia
>> > [3]:https://twitter.com/AlecMuffett/status/933739816038076419
>> > [4]: https://github.com/alecmuffett/eotk
>> > [5]:
>> > https://arstechnica.com/information-technology/2014/
>> > 10/facebook-offers-hidden-service-to-tor-users/
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/
>> > wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/
>> > wiki/Wikimedia-l
>> > New messages to: [hidden email]
>> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> ________________________________________________________
>> <http://nerds.kozminski.edu.pl/> prof. dr hab. Dariusz Jemielniak
>> kierownik katedry MINDS (Management in Networked and Digital Societies)
>> Akademia Leona Koźmińskiego
>> http://NeRDS.kozminski.edu.pl  <http://nerds.kozminski.edu.pl/>
>>
>> associate faculty w Berkman-Klein Center for Internet and Society,
>> Harvard University
>> *Ostatnie artykuły:*
>>
>>    - Dariusz Jemielniak, Maciej Wilamowski (2017)  Cultural Diversity of
>>    Quality of Information on Wikipedias
>>    <http://crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/cultures%20of%20wikipedias.pdf>
>> *Journal
>>    of the Association for Information Science and Technology* 68:  10.
>>     2460–2470.
>>    - Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Wikimedia Movement Governance: The Limits
>>    of A-Hierarchical Organization
>>    <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/wikimedia_governance.pdf>
>> *Journal
>>    of Organizational Change Management *29:  3.  361-378.
>>    - Dariusz Jemielniak, Eduard Aibar (2016)  Bridging the Gap Between
>>    Wikipedia and Academia
>>    <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/bridging.pdf> *Journal of the
>>    Association for Information Science and Technology* 67:  7.  1773-1776.
>>    - Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)  Breaking the Glass Ceiling on Wikipedia
>>    <http://www.crow.kozminski.edu.pl/papers/glass-ceiling.pdf> *Feminist
>>    Review *113:  1.  103-108.
>>    - Tadeusz Chełkowski, Peter Gloor, Dariusz Jemielniak (2016)
>> Inequalities
>>    in Open Source Software Development: Analysis of Contributor’s Commits
>> in
>>    Apache Software Foundation Projects
>>    <<a href="http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/asset?id=10.1371%">http://journals.plos.org/plosone/article/asset?id=10.1371%
>> 2Fjournal.pone.0152976.PDF>
>>    , *PLoS ONE* 11:  4.  e0152976.
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik
>> i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik
>> i/Wikimedia-l
>> New messages to: [hidden email]
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Tilman Bayer
> Senior Analyst
> Wikimedia Foundation
> IRC (Freenode): HaeB
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Experimental onion service for all Wikimedia projects set up by Alec Muffett

Antoine Musso-3
In reply to this post by Tilman Bayer
On 24/11/2017 19:37, Tilman Bayer wrote:
> I think this is unlikely to happen, because of the performance degradation
> (access via Tor will always be slower, which user studies
> <http://www.mdpi.com/1999-5903/4/2/488/htm> have shown to be a significant
> usability issue in the past). But as an option or fallback or separate app
> it might be a great idea; there is a Phabricator task at
> https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T163747

And for a Tor service that is (which I made a subtask):

  Tor hidden service for WMF websites
  https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T168218


--
Antoine "hashar" Musso


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