[Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

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[Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Leila Zia
Hi all,

As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
demographics and user motivations and characteristics).

If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on how
much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this is
your chance to indicate interest at:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages

I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up. Since
then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating some
of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.

As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no action
is needed. :)

Best,
Leila

[1] https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Gerard Meijssen-3
Hoi,
I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but really
why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people are
actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what proves
to be of interest [1] ?
Thanks,
     GerardM

[1]
https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html

On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
>
> If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on how
> much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this is
> your chance to indicate interest at:
>
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
>
> I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up. Since
> then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating some
> of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
>
> As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no action
> is needed. :)
>
> Best,
> Leila
>
> [1]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Vi to
The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱

Vito

Il giorno dom 10 mar 2019 alle ore 22:26 Gerard Meijssen <
[hidden email]> ha scritto:

> Hoi,
> I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but really
> why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people are
> actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what proves
> to be of interest [1] ?
> Thanks,
>      GerardM
>
> [1]
>
> https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html
>
> On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Hi all,
> >
> > As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> > surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> > reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> > their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> > demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
> >
> > If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> > distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> > geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on how
> > much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this is
> > your chance to indicate interest at:
> >
> >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
> >
> > I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up. Since
> > then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating some
> > of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> > needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
> >
> > As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> > community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no action
> > is needed. :)
> >
> > Best,
> > Leila
> >
> > [1]
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

David Goodman-2
The idea of an encyclopedia is to provide the information people need or
want  that's appropriate to the format. It would be useful to see what they
want that is appropriate but we do not have -- and also useful to see what
they look for that isn't appropriate for us. Within what's appropriate, I
see no reason why selection of topics should not be driven by reader
interests as much as by editor interests. Our purpose is not to practice
our writing skills for our own benefit.

On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 6:58 PM Vi to <[hidden email]> wrote:

> The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
>
> Vito
>
> Il giorno dom 10 mar 2019 alle ore 22:26 Gerard Meijssen <
> [hidden email]> ha scritto:
>
> > Hoi,
> > I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but really
> > why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people are
> > actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what proves
> > to be of interest [1] ?
> > Thanks,
> >      GerardM
> >
> > [1]
> >
> >
> https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html
> >
> > On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> > > surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> > > reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> > > their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> > > demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
> > >
> > > If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> > > distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> > > geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on how
> > > much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this is
> > > your chance to indicate interest at:
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
> > >
> > > I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up. Since
> > > then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating some
> > > of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> > > needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
> > >
> > > As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> > > community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no action
> > > is needed. :)
> > >
> > > Best,
> > > Leila
> > >
> > > [1]
> > >
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>



--
David Goodman

DGG at the enWP
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:DGG
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:DGG
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Vi to
That's an unstable process on a long-term, with popular topics
cannibalizing resources. Top read articles are already about two or three
sports, some TV series and three or four music topics.
These are also the most popular topics among editors but if you'll start
focusing energies on these already popular topics you'll end up having no
resources to be spent on "female combatants during Russian civil war",
"near to extinction languages in Brazil", "computational chemestry in late
XX century".

The way we self-identify as a project  deeply affects our results:
promoting the idea of Wikipedia as "the pop encyclopedia" (instead of "the
free encyclopedia embedding pop topics") will weaken our commitment to
diversity and quality.

Also, topic popularity is mutable on a daily basis and it's driven by a
very narrow number of media (basically Google/YouTube and Facebook) which
will gain a complete influence over us.

To me the mission of an encyclopedia is providing the *knowledge* (not
*information*) which is worth collecting and preserving. The information
people need/want is likely to be a subset of this.

If Wikipedia is also an educational medium we should find a way to ask the
ordes of people looking for new mr. Trump's bizarreness "hey, do you know
the background of India-Pakistan conflicts?"

Vito

Il giorno lun 11 mar 2019 alle ore 06:19 David Goodman <[hidden email]>
ha scritto:

> The idea of an encyclopedia is to provide the information people need or
> want  that's appropriate to the format. It would be useful to see what they
> want that is appropriate but we do not have -- and also useful to see what
> they look for that isn't appropriate for us. Within what's appropriate, I
> see no reason why selection of topics should not be driven by reader
> interests as much as by editor interests. Our purpose is not to practice
> our writing skills for our own benefit.
>
> On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 6:58 PM Vi to <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
> >
> > Vito
> >
> > Il giorno dom 10 mar 2019 alle ore 22:26 Gerard Meijssen <
> > [hidden email]> ha scritto:
> >
> > > Hoi,
> > > I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but
> really
> > > why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people are
> > > actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what
> proves
> > > to be of interest [1] ?
> > > Thanks,
> > >      GerardM
> > >
> > > [1]
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html
> > >
> > > On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi all,
> > > >
> > > > As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> > > > surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> > > > reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> > > > their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> > > > demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
> > > >
> > > > If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> > > > distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> > > > geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on
> how
> > > > much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this
> is
> > > > your chance to indicate interest at:
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
> > > >
> > > > I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up. Since
> > > > then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating
> some
> > > > of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> > > > needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
> > > >
> > > > As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> > > > community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no action
> > > > is needed. :)
> > > >
> > > > Best,
> > > > Leila
> > > >
> > > > [1]
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > > Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
>
> --
> David Goodman
>
> DGG at the enWP
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:DGG
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:DGG
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
_______________________________________________
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Gerard Meijssen-3
In reply to this post by Vi to
Hoi,
What is it that scares youi? When you want to write about the subject that
you care about do. If it is popular good. That is all.

What scares me is that people define what others want to / need to know.
What is the propblem with providing what people are looking for? In the big
Wikipedias almost everything is there including pokemon, soccer and ice
hockey...
Thanks,
        GerardM

On Sun, 10 Mar 2019 at 23:58, Vi to <[hidden email]> wrote:

> The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
>
> Vito
>
> Il giorno dom 10 mar 2019 alle ore 22:26 Gerard Meijssen <
> [hidden email]> ha scritto:
>
> > Hoi,
> > I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but really
> > why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people are
> > actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what proves
> > to be of interest [1] ?
> > Thanks,
> >      GerardM
> >
> > [1]
> >
> >
> https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html
> >
> > On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > Hi all,
> > >
> > > As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> > > surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> > > reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> > > their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> > > demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
> > >
> > > If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> > > distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> > > geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on how
> > > much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this is
> > > your chance to indicate interest at:
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
> > >
> > > I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up. Since
> > > then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating some
> > > of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> > > needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
> > >
> > > As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> > > community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no action
> > > is needed. :)
> > >
> > > Best,
> > > Leila
> > >
> > > [1]
> > >
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Gerard Meijssen-3
In reply to this post by Vi to
Hoi,
You will not see me write about subjects I do not care about. So the notion
that anyone writing about subjects you care about is a fallacy. It takes
horses for courses, you will write about what you care about and so will I.
Others may look into what is missing and find that their subject matter
expertise is called for.

When you state that Mr Trump does not know about Indian-Pakistan conflicts,
does he know that a Nigerian governor outspends presidents of neighbouring
countries.. There are elections for Nigerian governors...

When Mr Trump does not know, and we do not either, we EXACTLY find a spike
in a subject people are looking for..
Thanks,
       GerardM

On Mon, 11 Mar 2019 at 10:07, Vi to <[hidden email]> wrote:

> That's an unstable process on a long-term, with popular topics
> cannibalizing resources. Top read articles are already about two or three
> sports, some TV series and three or four music topics.
> These are also the most popular topics among editors but if you'll start
> focusing energies on these already popular topics you'll end up having no
> resources to be spent on "female combatants during Russian civil war",
> "near to extinction languages in Brazil", "computational chemestry in late
> XX century".
>
> The way we self-identify as a project  deeply affects our results:
> promoting the idea of Wikipedia as "the pop encyclopedia" (instead of "the
> free encyclopedia embedding pop topics") will weaken our commitment to
> diversity and quality.
>
> Also, topic popularity is mutable on a daily basis and it's driven by a
> very narrow number of media (basically Google/YouTube and Facebook) which
> will gain a complete influence over us.
>
> To me the mission of an encyclopedia is providing the *knowledge* (not
> *information*) which is worth collecting and preserving. The information
> people need/want is likely to be a subset of this.
>
> If Wikipedia is also an educational medium we should find a way to ask the
> ordes of people looking for new mr. Trump's bizarreness "hey, do you know
> the background of India-Pakistan conflicts?"
>
> Vito
>
> Il giorno lun 11 mar 2019 alle ore 06:19 David Goodman <[hidden email]>
> ha scritto:
>
> > The idea of an encyclopedia is to provide the information people need or
> > want  that's appropriate to the format. It would be useful to see what
> they
> > want that is appropriate but we do not have -- and also useful to see
> what
> > they look for that isn't appropriate for us. Within what's appropriate, I
> > see no reason why selection of topics should not be driven by reader
> > interests as much as by editor interests. Our purpose is not to practice
> > our writing skills for our own benefit.
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 6:58 PM Vi to <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
> > >
> > > Vito
> > >
> > > Il giorno dom 10 mar 2019 alle ore 22:26 Gerard Meijssen <
> > > [hidden email]> ha scritto:
> > >
> > > > Hoi,
> > > > I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but
> > really
> > > > why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people
> are
> > > > actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what
> > proves
> > > > to be of interest [1] ?
> > > > Thanks,
> > > >      GerardM
> > > >
> > > > [1]
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hi all,
> > > > >
> > > > > As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> > > > > surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> > > > > reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> > > > > their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> > > > > demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
> > > > >
> > > > > If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> > > > > distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> > > > > geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on
> > how
> > > > > much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this
> > is
> > > > > your chance to indicate interest at:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
> > > > >
> > > > > I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up.
> Since
> > > > > then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating
> > some
> > > > > of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> > > > > needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
> > > > >
> > > > > As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> > > > > community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no
> action
> > > > > is needed. :)
> > > > >
> > > > > Best,
> > > > > Leila
> > > > >
> > > > > [1]
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > > > Unsubscribe:
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > > <mailto:[hidden email]
> ?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > > Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > David Goodman
> >
> > DGG at the enWP
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:DGG
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:DGG
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l
In reply to this post by Vi to
 I know people in many fields with great technical expertise. people who published articles on Science and Nature basically, and in the end I think they are probably qualified to have an idea of what a good encyclopedia should be. The point is that these people open wiki for topics far away from their area, most of the time they look also for "pop" topics. Finding pop culture is what makes them stay and grow interest as much as everything else. It's when they find a deleted ye useful page of something of interest for some internal reason they think wikipedia it's not worth spending time on.

Based on that experience, in all the discussions when people who claim that this focus on such pop information lower our image or damage our workflow, I always question where these opinions come from and if they are peer-reviewed. I am a scientist, I look at data. it has been years people are claiming the "popmaggedon" of wikipedia is soon, and in the meantime its overall quality on very specific topic is still increasing.

A balanced encyclopedia comes from trying to fill the gaps, all information are useful in that direction. As long as someone else is studying missing links, pages existing in other languages, encouraging what editors want and so on, your idea is just part of patchwork. I cannot peer-review such statement, but at least i can tell you it is said by someone who never edited a "pop" article in all his wikipedia life and manage projects of outreach in organic chemistry or biophysics, to name the last ones. So I hope that it gives a hint that is probably fine.
Go on and explore.



    Il lunedì 11 marzo 2019, 10:08:23 CET, Vi to <[hidden email]> ha scritto:  
 
 That's an unstable process on a long-term, with popular topics
cannibalizing resources. Top read articles are already about two or three
sports, some TV series and three or four music topics.
These are also the most popular topics among editors but if you'll start
focusing energies on these already popular topics you'll end up having no
resources to be spent on "female combatants during Russian civil war",
"near to extinction languages in Brazil", "computational chemestry in late
XX century".

The way we self-identify as a project  deeply affects our results:
promoting the idea of Wikipedia as "the pop encyclopedia" (instead of "the
free encyclopedia embedding pop topics") will weaken our commitment to
diversity and quality.

Also, topic popularity is mutable on a daily basis and it's driven by a
very narrow number of media (basically Google/YouTube and Facebook) which
will gain a complete influence over us.

To me the mission of an encyclopedia is providing the *knowledge* (not
*information*) which is worth collecting and preserving. The information
people need/want is likely to be a subset of this.

If Wikipedia is also an educational medium we should find a way to ask the
ordes of people looking for new mr. Trump's bizarreness "hey, do you know
the background of India-Pakistan conflicts?"

Vito

Il giorno lun 11 mar 2019 alle ore 06:19 David Goodman <[hidden email]>
ha scritto:

> The idea of an encyclopedia is to provide the information people need or
> want  that's appropriate to the format. It would be useful to see what they
> want that is appropriate but we do not have -- and also useful to see what
> they look for that isn't appropriate for us. Within what's appropriate, I
> see no reason why selection of topics should not be driven by reader
> interests as much as by editor interests. Our purpose is not to practice
> our writing skills for our own benefit.
>
> On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 6:58 PM Vi to <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
> >
> > Vito
> >
> > Il giorno dom 10 mar 2019 alle ore 22:26 Gerard Meijssen <
> > [hidden email]> ha scritto:
> >
> > > Hoi,
> > > I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but
> really
> > > why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people are
> > > actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what
> proves
> > > to be of interest [1] ?
> > > Thanks,
> > >      GerardM
> > >
> > > [1]
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html
> > >
> > > On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi all,
> > > >
> > > > As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> > > > surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> > > > reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> > > > their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> > > > demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
> > > >
> > > > If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> > > > distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> > > > geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on
> how
> > > > much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this
> is
> > > > your chance to indicate interest at:
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
> > > >
> > > > I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up. Since
> > > > then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating
> some
> > > > of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> > > > needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
> > > >
> > > > As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> > > > community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no action
> > > > is needed. :)
> > > >
> > > > Best,
> > > > Leila
> > > >
> > > > [1]
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > > Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
>
> --
> David Goodman
>
> DGG at the enWP
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:DGG
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:DGG
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
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> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Amir E. Aharoni
In reply to this post by Vi to


> The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
>
>
I agree, although I'd make it a bit more focused: an encyclopedia that is
*only* popularity-driven is indeed scary. It's good to mention this, and
not once, but repeatedly.

However, providing Wikipedia editors with information about what *is* in
demand is useful, as long as the editors clearly know that they have the
choice to write what is *important* and that "important" is not equal to
"popular".

While I haven't ran a proper survey about this, conversations that with
Wikipedia editors from various "big" and "small" languages tell me that
most of them already understand it, and this is good. Nevertheless,
reminding people that Wikipedia is not supposed to be just about covering
popular topics won't hurt.

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
http://aharoni.wordpress.com
‪“We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Amir E. Aharoni
In reply to this post by Gerard Meijssen-3
‫בתאריך יום א׳, 10 במרץ 2019 ב-23:27 מאת ‪Gerard Meijssen‬‏ <‪
[hidden email]‬‏>:‬

> Hoi,
> I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but really
> why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people are
> actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what proves
> to be of interest [1] ?
>

Actually, there was some work done around it. Here are some examples:

1. The Discovery (Search) team in the Foundation researched searches in
Wikimedia sites' search box that yielded zero results. This was done in
2016 or so, led by Dan Garry as the product manager, and this lead to some
improvements in the functionality of Wikimedia sites' internal search
engine, although I don't remember what they were exactly.

2. Google's Project Tiger provided lists of articles for which people often
search in the Google search engine in India, and about which there are no
articles in Wikipedias in languages of India. See
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Supporting_Indian_Language_Wikipedias_Program

3. Last year I made a list of articles that people search for in their
language using the interlanguage links search box and cannot find. You can
see a sample here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Amire80/WEIRD/2018-04-09%E2%80%932018-04-15
. I plan to make this list nicer-looking and auto-updating some time soon.

4. The GapFinder project is another tool that helps people find articles
that are missing in some wikis: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/GapFinder

5. This is just an idea, but it's written down, which is a bit better than
nothing: Show the most popular articles by country in the PageViews tool,
rather than just by language. It's documented at
https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T207171 . The rationale for this is that
the most popular English Wikipedia articles in the U.S., Nigeria, India,
the Philippines, and South Africa are significantly different. The English
Wikipedia is the most popular one in all these countries, but whereas it is
sensible that it's popular in the U.S., it's a bit depressing that it's
also the most popular in the other four countries, even though languages
other than English are spoken there. The reason for this situation is, of
course, that there is little content in the Wikipedias in the languages of
these countries, and knowing what the most popular articles are can help
people who write in these languages choose how to write that will be
useful, and will hopefully raise the popularity of Wikipedias in these
languages. The same is true for the most popular Russian Wikipedia articles
in Kyrgyzstan and Moldova, the most popular French Wikipedia articles in
Benin and Mali, etc. This is only an idea, but maybe it will be implemented
some day.

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
http://aharoni.wordpress.com
‪“We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l
In reply to this post by Amir E. Aharoni
Reminding is easy, it's analyzing that it's complex.

I suspect that editors and readers are probably a little bit smarter than generally assumed. It's quite "obvious" that editors understand what is an encyclopedia, after years. When I make an informal survey, statistically the "smarter" students in the class or in the group of people in front of me at an event are those who already edited something or who want to know more or are willing to compile a form to state their opinion or similar.

Plus, every topic is multifaceted somehow, it's the same for the most popular ones. It's strange when long-time editors seem to miss this aspect. There is always a specific disease, an historical event, a place or a person in a family history linked to a most searched topic. You can detect many missing specific things just focusing on a core topic and starting from there. Again, maybe it's worth reminding also how our editors are quite good at doing this, and this type of information is therefore a starting point. In some of this comments, it always look like an end per se.

Seriously, if someone is so superficial to just edit something with no depth because it's on a list, (s)he will just do something equally superficial somewhere else. Clinically, I might state that it's probably a good thing if this occur in an area with huge focus, it actually lowers the possible long-term disfunctionalities induced by a rigid approach, something that it's more subtle to detect in less supervised areas.

in any case, these lists can change a lot from area to area so it is not even driven by the "mass", if you give a country in South America or Asia the same focus on a western country you end up with very unusual guideline. it's nice to know that you expertise in an area even if less taken into account in the average community around you, it's useful in a different part of the word.



    Il lunedì 11 marzo 2019, 13:32:12 CET, Amir E. Aharoni <[hidden email]> ha scritto:  
 
 ‬

> The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
>
>
I agree, although I'd make it a bit more focused: an encyclopedia that is
*only* popularity-driven is indeed scary. It's good to mention this, and
not once, but repeatedly.

However, providing Wikipedia editors with information about what *is* in
demand is useful, as long as the editors clearly know that they have the
choice to write what is *important* and that "important" is not equal to
"popular".

While I haven't ran a proper survey about this, conversations that with
Wikipedia editors from various "big" and "small" languages tell me that
most of them already understand it, and this is good. Nevertheless,
reminding people that Wikipedia is not supposed to be just about covering
popular topics won't hurt.

--
Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
http://aharoni.wordpress.com
‪“We're living in pieces,
I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬
_______________________________________________
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Edward Saperia
In reply to this post by Amir E. Aharoni
We can consider this an opportunity, e.g. popular media often touches on
diverse cultural and political themes, and international sports tournaments
give people a reason to learn about different countries. If people find our
project this way then so be it, we can just try and make sure those
articles great starting points for further exploration
<https://xkcd.com/214/>.

Ed


On Mon, 11 Mar 2019 at 12:31, Amir E. Aharoni <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> ‬
>
> > The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
> >
> >
> I agree, although I'd make it a bit more focused: an encyclopedia that is
> *only* popularity-driven is indeed scary. It's good to mention this, and
> not once, but repeatedly.
>
> However, providing Wikipedia editors with information about what *is* in
> demand is useful, as long as the editors clearly know that they have the
> choice to write what is *important* and that "important" is not equal to
> "popular".
>
> While I haven't ran a proper survey about this, conversations that with
> Wikipedia editors from various "big" and "small" languages tell me that
> most of them already understand it, and this is good. Nevertheless,
> reminding people that Wikipedia is not supposed to be just about covering
> popular topics won't hurt.
>
> --
> Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
> http://aharoni.wordpress.com
> ‪“We're living in pieces,
> I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
_______________________________________________
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Gerard Meijssen-3
In reply to this post by Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l
Hoi,
The point is EXACTLY that this list will be different per language. What
there is, what is needed differs as a consequence. What specific Wikipedias
covers is as different.

There are multiple objectives to be gained:

   - as we gain more articles, we will gain a bigger presence for a
   Wikipedia in Google
   - a bigger presence will give us more eye balls.
   - more people who edit a Wikipedia means that any and all subjects of
   their choosing become better covered

When we choose for an approach like this, it is very much in the true Wiki
spirit. When the argument is about "supervision", the question is how that
would work. In my opinion, you are likely not to know the other language
and Google translate is unlikely to function for all the 280+ languages.

The point of this approach is very much that there is no solution for all
of Wikipedia.. It is weird to suggest that would work in the first place.
Thanks,
        GerardM

On Mon, 11 Mar 2019 at 14:08, Alessandro Marchetti via Wikimedia-l <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Reminding is easy, it's analyzing that it's complex.
>
> I suspect that editors and readers are probably a little bit smarter than
> generally assumed. It's quite "obvious" that editors understand what is an
> encyclopedia, after years. When I make an informal survey, statistically
> the "smarter" students in the class or in the group of people in front of
> me at an event are those who already edited something or who want to know
> more or are willing to compile a form to state their opinion or similar.
>
> Plus, every topic is multifaceted somehow, it's the same for the most
> popular ones. It's strange when long-time editors seem to miss this aspect.
> There is always a specific disease, an historical event, a place or a
> person in a family history linked to a most searched topic. You can detect
> many missing specific things just focusing on a core topic and starting
> from there. Again, maybe it's worth reminding also how our editors are
> quite good at doing this, and this type of information is therefore a
> starting point. In some of this comments, it always look like an end per
> se.
>
> Seriously, if someone is so superficial to just edit something with no
> depth because it's on a list, (s)he will just do something equally
> superficial somewhere else. Clinically, I might state that it's probably a
> good thing if this occur in an area with huge focus, it actually lowers the
> possible long-term disfunctionalities induced by a rigid approach,
> something that it's more subtle to detect in less supervised areas.
>
> in any case, these lists can change a lot from area to area so it is not
> even driven by the "mass", if you give a country in South America or Asia
> the same focus on a western country you end up with very unusual guideline.
> it's nice to know that you expertise in an area even if less taken into
> account in the average community around you, it's useful in a different
> part of the word.
>
>
>
>     Il lunedì 11 marzo 2019, 13:32:12 CET, Amir E. Aharoni <
> [hidden email]> ha scritto:
>
>  ‬
>
> > The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
> >
> >
> I agree, although I'd make it a bit more focused: an encyclopedia that is
> *only* popularity-driven is indeed scary. It's good to mention this, and
> not once, but repeatedly.
>
> However, providing Wikipedia editors with information about what *is* in
> demand is useful, as long as the editors clearly know that they have the
> choice to write what is *important* and that "important" is not equal to
> "popular".
>
> While I haven't ran a proper survey about this, conversations that with
> Wikipedia editors from various "big" and "small" languages tell me that
> most of them already understand it, and this is good. Nevertheless,
> reminding people that Wikipedia is not supposed to be just about covering
> popular topics won't hurt.
>
> --
> Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
> http://aharoni.wordpress.com
> ‪“We're living in pieces,
> I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Leila Zia
In reply to this post by Edward Saperia
Hi all,

This is a very interesting discussion. I'm going to fork this thread in the
next 2 hours (unless one of you do this in the meantime) for us to continue
the conversation around using search as a signal for improving Wikipedia in
there. It would be best, for current and future readability, to keep the
focus of the current thread on the original topic.

Thanks,
Leila

On Mon, Mar 11, 2019 at 7:51 AM Edward Saperia <[hidden email]> wrote:

> We can consider this an opportunity, e.g. popular media often touches on
> diverse cultural and political themes, and international sports tournaments
> give people a reason to learn about different countries. If people find our
> project this way then so be it, we can just try and make sure those
> articles great starting points for further exploration
> <https://xkcd.com/214/>.
>
> Ed
>
>
> On Mon, 11 Mar 2019 at 12:31, Amir E. Aharoni <
> [hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > ‬
> >
> > > The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
> > >
> > >
> > I agree, although I'd make it a bit more focused: an encyclopedia that is
> > *only* popularity-driven is indeed scary. It's good to mention this, and
> > not once, but repeatedly.
> >
> > However, providing Wikipedia editors with information about what *is* in
> > demand is useful, as long as the editors clearly know that they have the
> > choice to write what is *important* and that "important" is not equal to
> > "popular".
> >
> > While I haven't ran a proper survey about this, conversations that with
> > Wikipedia editors from various "big" and "small" languages tell me that
> > most of them already understand it, and this is good. Nevertheless,
> > reminding people that Wikipedia is not supposed to be just about covering
> > popular topics won't hurt.
> >
> > --
> > Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
> > http://aharoni.wordpress.com
> > ‪“We're living in pieces,
> > I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Peter Southwood
In reply to this post by Natacha Rault via Wikimedia-l
We edit what we choose to edit. Usually the is things we are interested in and know something about. 2 billion people can go search for something I have no interest in and it will not move me to edit that topic. However, if a fairly substantial number of people look for something I am interested in and it is not covered, I may well spend some time improving coverage of the missing material, assuming I can find reliable sources. I don't think I am unique in this attitude, so I predict that getting good feedback on what is missing will inspire the people who would edit those subjects anyway, to improve them. It is very interesting and useful to me to know what readers are missing from my special interest areas and a complete waste of my time nd everyone else's to flood me with information on what people don’t find on topics I have no interest in editing. I will go to the trouble of trying to add information on a topic if even one person clearly and politely asks for it on a talk page. Also if someone does not understand what is written I will try to clarify, as that also improves the encyclopaedia. Clear, well targeted feedback is good, floods of garbage is not. Cheers,
Peter

-----Original Message-----
From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Alessandro Marchetti via Wikimedia-l
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2019 1:53 PM
To: Wikimedia Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

 I know people in many fields with great technical expertise. people who published articles on Science and Nature basically, and in the end I think they are probably qualified to have an idea of what a good encyclopedia should be. The point is that these people open wiki for topics far away from their area, most of the time they look also for "pop" topics. Finding pop culture is what makes them stay and grow interest as much as everything else. It's when they find a deleted ye useful page of something of interest for some internal reason they think wikipedia it's not worth spending time on.

Based on that experience, in all the discussions when people who claim that this focus on such pop information lower our image or damage our workflow, I always question where these opinions come from and if they are peer-reviewed. I am a scientist, I look at data. it has been years people are claiming the "popmaggedon" of wikipedia is soon, and in the meantime its overall quality on very specific topic is still increasing.

A balanced encyclopedia comes from trying to fill the gaps, all information are useful in that direction. As long as someone else is studying missing links, pages existing in other languages, encouraging what editors want and so on, your idea is just part of patchwork. I cannot peer-review such statement, but at least i can tell you it is said by someone who never edited a "pop" article in all his wikipedia life and manage projects of outreach in organic chemistry or biophysics, to name the last ones. So I hope that it gives a hint that is probably fine.
Go on and explore.



    Il lunedì 11 marzo 2019, 10:08:23 CET, Vi to <[hidden email]> ha scritto:  
 
 That's an unstable process on a long-term, with popular topics
cannibalizing resources. Top read articles are already about two or three
sports, some TV series and three or four music topics.
These are also the most popular topics among editors but if you'll start
focusing energies on these already popular topics you'll end up having no
resources to be spent on "female combatants during Russian civil war",
"near to extinction languages in Brazil", "computational chemestry in late
XX century".

The way we self-identify as a project  deeply affects our results:
promoting the idea of Wikipedia as "the pop encyclopedia" (instead of "the
free encyclopedia embedding pop topics") will weaken our commitment to
diversity and quality.

Also, topic popularity is mutable on a daily basis and it's driven by a
very narrow number of media (basically Google/YouTube and Facebook) which
will gain a complete influence over us.

To me the mission of an encyclopedia is providing the *knowledge* (not
*information*) which is worth collecting and preserving. The information
people need/want is likely to be a subset of this.

If Wikipedia is also an educational medium we should find a way to ask the
ordes of people looking for new mr. Trump's bizarreness "hey, do you know
the background of India-Pakistan conflicts?"

Vito

Il giorno lun 11 mar 2019 alle ore 06:19 David Goodman <[hidden email]>
ha scritto:

> The idea of an encyclopedia is to provide the information people need or
> want  that's appropriate to the format. It would be useful to see what they
> want that is appropriate but we do not have -- and also useful to see what
> they look for that isn't appropriate for us. Within what's appropriate, I
> see no reason why selection of topics should not be driven by reader
> interests as much as by editor interests. Our purpose is not to practice
> our writing skills for our own benefit.
>
> On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 6:58 PM Vi to <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
> >
> > Vito
> >
> > Il giorno dom 10 mar 2019 alle ore 22:26 Gerard Meijssen <
> > [hidden email]> ha scritto:
> >
> > > Hoi,
> > > I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but
> really
> > > why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people are
> > > actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what
> proves
> > > to be of interest [1] ?
> > > Thanks,
> > >      GerardM
> > >
> > > [1]
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html
> > >
> > > On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi all,
> > > >
> > > > As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> > > > surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> > > > reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> > > > their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> > > > demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
> > > >
> > > > If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> > > > distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> > > > geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on
> how
> > > > much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this
> is
> > > > your chance to indicate interest at:
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
> > > >
> > > > I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up. Since
> > > > then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating
> some
> > > > of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> > > > needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
> > > >
> > > > As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> > > > community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no action
> > > > is needed. :)
> > > >
> > > > Best,
> > > > Leila
> > > >
> > > > [1]
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > > Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
>
> --
> David Goodman
>
> DGG at the enWP
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:DGG
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:DGG
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
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> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Peter Southwood
In reply to this post by Vi to
Vito,
I do not agree with you, but that may be because we edit differently. I write about what I am interested in, and know enough about to be reasonably efficient. There is enough of it to keep me busy indefinitely. I read the topics that interest me and I don't know enough about to write. I copyedit anywhere I see a need while I am reading. I fix what I see to be broken if I can. I do not think I am unique, or even unusual. What do you write about? Is it greatly affected by what other people choose to read?
Cheers,
Peter

-----Original Message-----
From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Vi to
Sent: Monday, March 11, 2019 11:07 AM
To: Wikimedia Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

That's an unstable process on a long-term, with popular topics
cannibalizing resources. Top read articles are already about two or three
sports, some TV series and three or four music topics.
These are also the most popular topics among editors but if you'll start
focusing energies on these already popular topics you'll end up having no
resources to be spent on "female combatants during Russian civil war",
"near to extinction languages in Brazil", "computational chemestry in late
XX century".

The way we self-identify as a project  deeply affects our results:
promoting the idea of Wikipedia as "the pop encyclopedia" (instead of "the
free encyclopedia embedding pop topics") will weaken our commitment to
diversity and quality.

Also, topic popularity is mutable on a daily basis and it's driven by a
very narrow number of media (basically Google/YouTube and Facebook) which
will gain a complete influence over us.

To me the mission of an encyclopedia is providing the *knowledge* (not
*information*) which is worth collecting and preserving. The information
people need/want is likely to be a subset of this.

If Wikipedia is also an educational medium we should find a way to ask the
ordes of people looking for new mr. Trump's bizarreness "hey, do you know
the background of India-Pakistan conflicts?"

Vito

Il giorno lun 11 mar 2019 alle ore 06:19 David Goodman <[hidden email]>
ha scritto:

> The idea of an encyclopedia is to provide the information people need or
> want  that's appropriate to the format. It would be useful to see what they
> want that is appropriate but we do not have -- and also useful to see what
> they look for that isn't appropriate for us. Within what's appropriate, I
> see no reason why selection of topics should not be driven by reader
> interests as much as by editor interests. Our purpose is not to practice
> our writing skills for our own benefit.
>
> On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 6:58 PM Vi to <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
> >
> > Vito
> >
> > Il giorno dom 10 mar 2019 alle ore 22:26 Gerard Meijssen <
> > [hidden email]> ha scritto:
> >
> > > Hoi,
> > > I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but
> really
> > > why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people are
> > > actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what
> proves
> > > to be of interest [1] ?
> > > Thanks,
> > >      GerardM
> > >
> > > [1]
> > >
> > >
> >
> https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html
> > >
> > > On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hi all,
> > > >
> > > > As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> > > > surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> > > > reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> > > > their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> > > > demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
> > > >
> > > > If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> > > > distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> > > > geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on
> how
> > > > much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this
> is
> > > > your chance to indicate interest at:
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
> > > >
> > > > I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up. Since
> > > > then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating
> some
> > > > of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> > > > needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
> > > >
> > > > As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> > > > community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no action
> > > > is needed. :)
> > > >
> > > > Best,
> > > > Leila
> > > >
> > > > [1]
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > > Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
>
>
> --
> David Goodman
>
> DGG at the enWP
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:DGG
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:DGG
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
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> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Yaroslav Blanter
Peter,

I am also writing about what I am (sometimes mildly) interested in, and I
am sure there will be enough materials for me to edit until I die, but you
would be surprised to learn how many people have no idea on what they
could/should edit, and are happy to take suggestions.

Cheers
Yaroslav

On Mon, Mar 11, 2019 at 6:31 PM Peter Southwood <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Vito,
> I do not agree with you, but that may be because we edit differently. I
> write about what I am interested in, and know enough about to be reasonably
> efficient. There is enough of it to keep me busy indefinitely. I read the
> topics that interest me and I don't know enough about to write. I copyedit
> anywhere I see a need while I am reading. I fix what I see to be broken if
> I can. I do not think I am unique, or even unusual. What do you write
> about? Is it greatly affected by what other people choose to read?
> Cheers,
> Peter
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:[hidden email]] On
> Behalf Of Vi to
> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2019 11:07 AM
> To: Wikimedia Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?
>
> That's an unstable process on a long-term, with popular topics
> cannibalizing resources. Top read articles are already about two or three
> sports, some TV series and three or four music topics.
> These are also the most popular topics among editors but if you'll start
> focusing energies on these already popular topics you'll end up having no
> resources to be spent on "female combatants during Russian civil war",
> "near to extinction languages in Brazil", "computational chemestry in late
> XX century".
>
> The way we self-identify as a project  deeply affects our results:
> promoting the idea of Wikipedia as "the pop encyclopedia" (instead of "the
> free encyclopedia embedding pop topics") will weaken our commitment to
> diversity and quality.
>
> Also, topic popularity is mutable on a daily basis and it's driven by a
> very narrow number of media (basically Google/YouTube and Facebook) which
> will gain a complete influence over us.
>
> To me the mission of an encyclopedia is providing the *knowledge* (not
> *information*) which is worth collecting and preserving. The information
> people need/want is likely to be a subset of this.
>
> If Wikipedia is also an educational medium we should find a way to ask the
> ordes of people looking for new mr. Trump's bizarreness "hey, do you know
> the background of India-Pakistan conflicts?"
>
> Vito
>
> Il giorno lun 11 mar 2019 alle ore 06:19 David Goodman <[hidden email]>
> ha scritto:
>
> > The idea of an encyclopedia is to provide the information people need or
> > want  that's appropriate to the format. It would be useful to see what
> they
> > want that is appropriate but we do not have -- and also useful to see
> what
> > they look for that isn't appropriate for us. Within what's appropriate, I
> > see no reason why selection of topics should not be driven by reader
> > interests as much as by editor interests. Our purpose is not to practice
> > our writing skills for our own benefit.
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 6:58 PM Vi to <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
> > >
> > > Vito
> > >
> > > Il giorno dom 10 mar 2019 alle ore 22:26 Gerard Meijssen <
> > > [hidden email]> ha scritto:
> > >
> > > > Hoi,
> > > > I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but
> > really
> > > > why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people
> are
> > > > actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what
> > proves
> > > > to be of interest [1] ?
> > > > Thanks,
> > > >      GerardM
> > > >
> > > > [1]
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hi all,
> > > > >
> > > > > As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> > > > > surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> > > > > reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> > > > > their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> > > > > demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
> > > > >
> > > > > If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> > > > > distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> > > > > geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on
> > how
> > > > > much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this
> > is
> > > > > your chance to indicate interest at:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
> > > > >
> > > > > I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up.
> Since
> > > > > then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating
> > some
> > > > > of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> > > > > needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
> > > > >
> > > > > As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> > > > > community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no
> action
> > > > > is needed. :)
> > > > >
> > > > > Best,
> > > > > Leila
> > > > >
> > > > > [1]
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > > > Unsubscribe:
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > > <mailto:[hidden email]
> ?subject=unsubscribe>
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> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > David Goodman
> >
> > DGG at the enWP
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:DGG
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:DGG
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Ilario Valdelli
In reply to this post by Leila Zia
Hi Leila,

I have put my own but the problem we have in Switzerland is connected to
the multi-lingualism.

Italian, for instance, which is one big language in WIkipedia, is at the
opposite a minority in Switzerland.

Any study is interesting, but if it could be country-based, it would be
better.

Kind regards


On 06/03/2019 22:12, Leila Zia wrote:

> Hi all,
>
> As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
>
> If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on how
> much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this is
> your chance to indicate interest at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
>
> I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up. Since
> then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating some
> of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
>
> As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no action
> is needed. :)
>
> Best,
> Leila
>
> [1] https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> New messages to: [hidden email]
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Peter Southwood
In reply to this post by Yaroslav Blanter
Yaroslav,
I would be very interested to know how many, what percentage, and how much they actually contribute in terms of good content. Are there any stats available?
Cheers,
Peter

-----Original Message-----
From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Yaroslav Blanter
Sent: 11 March 2019 20:35
To: Wikimedia Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

Peter,

I am also writing about what I am (sometimes mildly) interested in, and I
am sure there will be enough materials for me to edit until I die, but you
would be surprised to learn how many people have no idea on what they
could/should edit, and are happy to take suggestions.

Cheers
Yaroslav

On Mon, Mar 11, 2019 at 6:31 PM Peter Southwood <
[hidden email]> wrote:

> Vito,
> I do not agree with you, but that may be because we edit differently. I
> write about what I am interested in, and know enough about to be reasonably
> efficient. There is enough of it to keep me busy indefinitely. I read the
> topics that interest me and I don't know enough about to write. I copyedit
> anywhere I see a need while I am reading. I fix what I see to be broken if
> I can. I do not think I am unique, or even unusual. What do you write
> about? Is it greatly affected by what other people choose to read?
> Cheers,
> Peter
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Wikimedia-l [mailto:[hidden email]] On
> Behalf Of Vi to
> Sent: Monday, March 11, 2019 11:07 AM
> To: Wikimedia Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?
>
> That's an unstable process on a long-term, with popular topics
> cannibalizing resources. Top read articles are already about two or three
> sports, some TV series and three or four music topics.
> These are also the most popular topics among editors but if you'll start
> focusing energies on these already popular topics you'll end up having no
> resources to be spent on "female combatants during Russian civil war",
> "near to extinction languages in Brazil", "computational chemestry in late
> XX century".
>
> The way we self-identify as a project  deeply affects our results:
> promoting the idea of Wikipedia as "the pop encyclopedia" (instead of "the
> free encyclopedia embedding pop topics") will weaken our commitment to
> diversity and quality.
>
> Also, topic popularity is mutable on a daily basis and it's driven by a
> very narrow number of media (basically Google/YouTube and Facebook) which
> will gain a complete influence over us.
>
> To me the mission of an encyclopedia is providing the *knowledge* (not
> *information*) which is worth collecting and preserving. The information
> people need/want is likely to be a subset of this.
>
> If Wikipedia is also an educational medium we should find a way to ask the
> ordes of people looking for new mr. Trump's bizarreness "hey, do you know
> the background of India-Pakistan conflicts?"
>
> Vito
>
> Il giorno lun 11 mar 2019 alle ore 06:19 David Goodman <[hidden email]>
> ha scritto:
>
> > The idea of an encyclopedia is to provide the information people need or
> > want  that's appropriate to the format. It would be useful to see what
> they
> > want that is appropriate but we do not have -- and also useful to see
> what
> > they look for that isn't appropriate for us. Within what's appropriate, I
> > see no reason why selection of topics should not be driven by reader
> > interests as much as by editor interests. Our purpose is not to practice
> > our writing skills for our own benefit.
> >
> > On Sun, Mar 10, 2019 at 6:58 PM Vi to <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > The idea of a popularity-driven encyclopaedia scares 😱
> > >
> > > Vito
> > >
> > > Il giorno dom 10 mar 2019 alle ore 22:26 Gerard Meijssen <
> > > [hidden email]> ha scritto:
> > >
> > > > Hoi,
> > > > I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but
> > really
> > > > why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people
> are
> > > > actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what
> > proves
> > > > to be of interest [1] ?
> > > > Thanks,
> > > >      GerardM
> > > >
> > > > [1]
> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://ultimategerardm.blogspot.com/2019/03/a-marketing-approach-to-what-it-is-that.html
> > > >
> > > > On Wed, 6 Mar 2019 at 22:13, Leila Zia <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > Hi all,
> > > > >
> > > > > As I mentioned in an earlier thread [1], we will be running reader
> > > > > surveys across a number of Wikipedia languages to learn about the
> > > > > reader needs and motivations in these languages as well as some of
> > > > > their demographic information (and perhaps the correlations between
> > > > > demographics and user motivations and characteristics).
> > > > >
> > > > > If your language community is interested to have statistics on the
> > > > > distribution of reader gender, age, education, native language, and
> > > > > geographic region (rural/urban) in your language (and depending on
> > how
> > > > > much data we collect in your language, perhaps more insights), this
> > is
> > > > > your chance to indicate interest at:
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Research_talk:Characterizing_Wikipedia_Reader_Behaviour/Demographics_and_Wikipedia_use_cases#Interested_languages
> > > > >
> > > > > I initially communicated 2019-02-15 as the deadline to sign up.
> Since
> > > > > then, we have run a pilot test on enwiki and we are investigating
> > some
> > > > > of the results to see if any changes in the survey questions are
> > > > > needed. You have now time until 2019-03-15 to indicate interest.
> > > > >
> > > > > As always: this call is primarily a service to your language
> > > > > community. If you like it, take action on it. If you don't, no
> action
> > > > > is needed. :)
> > > > >
> > > > > Best,
> > > > > Leila
> > > > >
> > > > > [1]
> > > > >
> > > >
> > >
> >
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/wikimedia-l/2019-February/091762.html
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > > > Unsubscribe:
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > > <mailto:[hidden email]
> ?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > > Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
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> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
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> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
> > > New messages to: [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > David Goodman
> >
> > DGG at the enWP
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:DGG
> > http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User_talk:DGG
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] How diverse are your readers?

James Salsman-2
In reply to this post by Amir E. Aharoni
Bamyers99's https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WP:POPULARLOWQUALITY
weekly list linked from the Community Portal "Help out" section
addresses the issue directly, thanks to ORES. It would be great if
that were adopted by the Foundation for Wikipedias other than English.

Also, the links from the numbers on WP:BACKLOG which used to sort the
backlog categories by pageviews are broken again. I thought
Dispenser's categorder got moved to Toolforge years ago, but
apparently it's no longer maintained?

On Mon, Mar 11, 2019 at 5:53 AM Amir E. Aharoni
<[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> ‫בתאריך יום א׳, 10 במרץ 2019 ב-23:27 מאת ‪Gerard Meijssen‬‏ <‪
> [hidden email]‬‏>:‬
>
> > Hoi,
> > I have been thinking about it.. There is a place for research but really
> > why can we not have the data that allows us to seek out what people are
> > actually looking for and do not find.. Why can we not promote what proves
> > to be of interest [1] ?
> >
>
> Actually, there was some work done around it. Here are some examples:
>
> 1. The Discovery (Search) team in the Foundation researched searches in
> Wikimedia sites' search box that yielded zero results. This was done in
> 2016 or so, led by Dan Garry as the product manager, and this lead to some
> improvements in the functionality of Wikimedia sites' internal search
> engine, although I don't remember what they were exactly.
>
> 2. Google's Project Tiger provided lists of articles for which people often
> search in the Google search engine in India, and about which there are no
> articles in Wikipedias in languages of India. See
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Supporting_Indian_Language_Wikipedias_Program
>
> 3. Last year I made a list of articles that people search for in their
> language using the interlanguage links search box and cannot find. You can
> see a sample here:
> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/User:Amire80/WEIRD/2018-04-09%E2%80%932018-04-15
> . I plan to make this list nicer-looking and auto-updating some time soon.
>
> 4. The GapFinder project is another tool that helps people find articles
> that are missing in some wikis: https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/GapFinder
>
> 5. This is just an idea, but it's written down, which is a bit better than
> nothing: Show the most popular articles by country in the PageViews tool,
> rather than just by language. It's documented at
> https://phabricator.wikimedia.org/T207171 . The rationale for this is that
> the most popular English Wikipedia articles in the U.S., Nigeria, India,
> the Philippines, and South Africa are significantly different. The English
> Wikipedia is the most popular one in all these countries, but whereas it is
> sensible that it's popular in the U.S., it's a bit depressing that it's
> also the most popular in the other four countries, even though languages
> other than English are spoken there. The reason for this situation is, of
> course, that there is little content in the Wikipedias in the languages of
> these countries, and knowing what the most popular articles are can help
> people who write in these languages choose how to write that will be
> useful, and will hopefully raise the popularity of Wikipedias in these
> languages. The same is true for the most popular Russian Wikipedia articles
> in Kyrgyzstan and Moldova, the most popular French Wikipedia articles in
> Benin and Mali, etc. This is only an idea, but maybe it will be implemented
> some day.
>
> --
> Amir Elisha Aharoni · אָמִיר אֱלִישָׁע אַהֲרוֹנִי
> http://aharoni.wordpress.com
> ‪“We're living in pieces,
> I want to live in peace.” – T. Moore‬
> _______________________________________________
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