[Wikimedia-l] Patent claim relating to QRpedia

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[Wikimedia-l] Patent claim relating to QRpedia

David Richfield
Hi all,

After the success of Monmouthpedia etc, we decided to try something
similar in South Africa - in collaboration with the Heritage
department of the City of Johannesburg.  After the President of
Wikimedia South Africa did a radio interview about the proposed
project, our contact in the City got this letter:

===

Dear Eric,

Kindly note that this email is sent without prejudice.

It would be greatly appreciated if you would consider the Walk and
Talk Tours patented system in 1999 with regards to information signage
relating back to electronic media to obtain information in respect of
a site.

To take this step further I would suggest that Johannesburg
Development Agency/ Johannesburg Arts and Culture/ Wikapedia etc
consider buying this concept from Walk and Talk Tours CC without the
necessity of going through unnecessary legal fees in using the
patented concept without the consent of Walk and Talk Tours CC.

Kind regards


Beryl Porter
www.walktours.co.za
Tel: +27 11 444 1639
Fax: +27 11 444 6128
Cell: +27 83 269 9769
email: [hidden email]

===

I did some research, and found the relevant patent here:
http://patentscope.wipo.int/search/en/WO2004021309

A brief review of the patent seems to indicate that it doesn't cover
anything except for phone calls, but the wording is sufficiently broad
that one could construe it to refer to any data sent over a wireless
network.  Can someone on this list please give an opinion?

Thanks,

--
David Richfield
[[:en:User:Slashme]]
+27718539985

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Patent claim relating to QRpedia

Fae-3
On 8 February 2013 10:22, David Richfield <[hidden email]> wrote:
> It would be greatly appreciated if you would consider the Walk and
> Talk Tours patented system in 1999 with regards to information signage
> relating back to electronic media to obtain information in respect of
> a site.

> A brief review of the patent seems to indicate that it doesn't cover
> anything except for phone calls, but the wording is sufficiently broad
> that one could construe it to refer to any data sent over a wireless
> network.  Can someone on this list please give an opinion?

I suggest you consider it as they requested, file it, and do not
reply. I see nothing in this patent that could be considered anything
infringed by QRPedia technology that is not long established as open
source or irrelevant.

My past experience, having worked in mobile technology for some years
and been part of managing the international IP for new technology, is
that the mobile technology sector lawyers (or more often
proto-lawyers) will scour the internet hunting for anything that might
get them a decent commission. Speculative letters are cheap to send
and as QRPedia gets more press coverage, this sort of contact is
likely to become very frequent.

This is not professional advice, I am not writing in my capacity in
any organization I am affiliated with or was affiliated with, blah,
blah, imagine a lengthy disclaimer here...

Thanks,
Fae
--
[hidden email] http://j.mp/faewm
Guide to email tags: http://j.mp/mfae

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Patent claim relating to QRpedia

Jane Darnell
"...without the necessity of going through unnecessary legal fees in using the
patented concept without the consent of..." - Is that a copyvio?
* See also
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patent_troll

2013/2/8, Fae <[hidden email]>:

> On 8 February 2013 10:22, David Richfield <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> It would be greatly appreciated if you would consider the Walk and
>> Talk Tours patented system in 1999 with regards to information signage
>> relating back to electronic media to obtain information in respect of
>> a site.
>
>> A brief review of the patent seems to indicate that it doesn't cover
>> anything except for phone calls, but the wording is sufficiently broad
>> that one could construe it to refer to any data sent over a wireless
>> network.  Can someone on this list please give an opinion?
>
> I suggest you consider it as they requested, file it, and do not
> reply. I see nothing in this patent that could be considered anything
> infringed by QRPedia technology that is not long established as open
> source or irrelevant.
>
> My past experience, having worked in mobile technology for some years
> and been part of managing the international IP for new technology, is
> that the mobile technology sector lawyers (or more often
> proto-lawyers) will scour the internet hunting for anything that might
> get them a decent commission. Speculative letters are cheap to send
> and as QRPedia gets more press coverage, this sort of contact is
> likely to become very frequent.
>
> This is not professional advice, I am not writing in my capacity in
> any organization I am affiliated with or was affiliated with, blah,
> blah, imagine a lengthy disclaimer here...
>
> Thanks,
> Fae
> --
> [hidden email] http://j.mp/faewm
> Guide to email tags: http://j.mp/mfae
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
>

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Patent claim relating to QRpedia

David Richfield
I don't see this as an actual patent troll: the people in question
actually use the technology that they patented for self-guided walking
tours: the tourist calls the number related to the specific site, and
hears information about it.  I think they were just a bit
overoptimistic about what was patentable, and/or how broad the
coverage given by their their patent was.

On Fri, Feb 8, 2013 at 12:52 PM, Jane Darnell <[hidden email]> wrote:

> "...without the necessity of going through unnecessary legal fees in using the
> patented concept without the consent of..." - Is that a copyvio?
> * See also
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patent_troll
>
> 2013/2/8, Fae <[hidden email]>:
>> On 8 February 2013 10:22, David Richfield <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> It would be greatly appreciated if you would consider the Walk and
>>> Talk Tours patented system in 1999 with regards to information signage
>>> relating back to electronic media to obtain information in respect of
>>> a site.
>>
>>> A brief review of the patent seems to indicate that it doesn't cover
>>> anything except for phone calls, but the wording is sufficiently broad
>>> that one could construe it to refer to any data sent over a wireless
>>> network.  Can someone on this list please give an opinion?
>>
>> I suggest you consider it as they requested, file it, and do not
>> reply. I see nothing in this patent that could be considered anything
>> infringed by QRPedia technology that is not long established as open
>> source or irrelevant.
>>
>> My past experience, having worked in mobile technology for some years
>> and been part of managing the international IP for new technology, is
>> that the mobile technology sector lawyers (or more often
>> proto-lawyers) will scour the internet hunting for anything that might
>> get them a decent commission. Speculative letters are cheap to send
>> and as QRPedia gets more press coverage, this sort of contact is
>> likely to become very frequent.
>>
>> This is not professional advice, I am not writing in my capacity in
>> any organization I am affiliated with or was affiliated with, blah,
>> blah, imagine a lengthy disclaimer here...
>>
>> Thanks,
>> Fae
>> --
>> [hidden email] http://j.mp/faewm
>> Guide to email tags: http://j.mp/mfae
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l



--
David Richfield
[[:en:User:Slashme]]
+27718539985

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Patent claim relating to QRpedia

David Gerard-2
On 8 February 2013 10:57, David Richfield <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I don't see this as an actual patent troll: the people in question
> actually use the technology that they patented for self-guided walking
> tours: the tourist calls the number related to the specific site, and
> hears information about it.  I think they were just a bit
> overoptimistic about what was patentable, and/or how broad the
> coverage given by their their patent was.


I think this letter itself, however, is pretty unambiguously an
example of the action of patent trolling.


- d.

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Patent claim relating to QRpedia

jmh649
In reply to this post by David Richfield
QRpedia is still owned by Roger Bamkin I think
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QRpedia The projects code appears to be
open source.

What does this mean for long term stability? How is the site licensed?
What authority do the volunteers / cities putting these up involved
have over its functioning?

--
James Heilman
MD, CCFP-EM, Wikipedian

The Wikipedia Open Textbook of Medicine
www.opentextbookofmedicine.com

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Patent claim relating to QRpedia

Fae-7
On 8 February 2013 17:53, James Heilman <[hidden email]> wrote:
> QRpedia is still owned by Roger Bamkin I think
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QRpedia The projects code appears to be
> open source.
>
> What does this mean for long term stability? How is the site licensed?
> What authority do the volunteers / cities putting these up involved
> have over its functioning?

Hi James,

See discussions at
<http://uk.wikimedia.org/wiki/Water_cooler#QR_codes> (and the later
thread on the same page), lots of information and discussion there,
and the Water Cooler will stay up to date as events progress. I
welcome further questions that have not already been raised to be
added there, I find it a handy place to reference.

As it happens, the UK Board is reviewing the negotiation tomorrow and
there may be an announcement to make then.

Thanks,
Fae
--
Ashley Van Haeften (Fae) [hidden email]
Wikimedia UK Trustee http://uk.wikimedia.org/wiki/Board
http://uk.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia:Email_disclaimer
Guide to email tags: http://j.mp/mfae

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Patent claim relating to QRpedia

Manuel Schneider-3
In reply to this post by jmh649
Am 08.02.2013 18:53, schrieb James Heilman:
> QRpedia is still owned by Roger Bamkin I think
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/QRpedia The projects code appears to be
> open source.

It is. You need to fiddle through it and find the right QR library which
is not included, though.

> What does this mean for long term stability? How is the site licensed?
> What authority do the volunteers / cities putting these up involved
> have over its functioning?

I managed to set up my own instance and got it working. So we have a
stand-by system.


/Manuel
--
Wikimedia CH - Verein zur Förderung Freien Wissens
Lausanne, +41 (21) 34066-22 - www.wikimedia.ch

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