[Wikimedia-l] Wikitribune!

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikitribune!

Matthew Flaschen
On 04/25/2017 05:59 PM, Jimmy Wales wrote:
> Today I announced a new initiative, outside of my Wikimedia activities,
> to combat fake news. It is important to me that I share directly with
> all of you information about this new initiative early on.

First I should say (putting aside the name, marketing, and potential COI
issues for a moment):

I welcome more independent journalism and fact-checking.  In a world of
media consolidation (that means the same people controlling more and
more of the media), more voices is a good thing.

> The new project  will use a wiki-style setup and experiment with
> bringing together professional journalists and community contributors to
> produce fact-checked, global news stories.

This (and particularly the name "Wikitribune") is one of my main concerns.

What defines a wiki is that you edit from the browser, and edits go live
immediately.  (There are limited exceptions like FlaggedRevisions, but a
site with 100% FlaggedRevisions is not a wiki, especially if approvals
are not by the community).

The BBC says, "However, while anybody can make changes to a page, they
will only go live if a staff member or trusted community volunteer
approves them."

If this is correct, it is not a wiki, and "wiki-style" is very debatable.

Calling something a wiki when it is not will lead to major brand
confusion with Wikipedia, particularly given your involvement.

Please clarify the model of the site, so we can assess this further.

Matt Flaschen

(Speaking only for myself in personal capacity.)

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikitribune!

Gerard Meijssen-3
Hoi,
Please remember what Wiki stands for; it is "quick". It is not Wikipedia.
It would be problematic when Wikitribune was called "WikipediaTribune".
Thanks,
       GerardM

On 28 April 2017 at 07:32, Matthew Flaschen <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> On 04/25/2017 05:59 PM, Jimmy Wales wrote:
>
>> Today I announced a new initiative, outside of my Wikimedia activities,
>> to combat fake news. It is important to me that I share directly with
>> all of you information about this new initiative early on.
>>
>
> First I should say (putting aside the name, marketing, and potential COI
> issues for a moment):
>
> I welcome more independent journalism and fact-checking.  In a world of
> media consolidation (that means the same people controlling more and more
> of the media), more voices is a good thing.
>
> The new project  will use a wiki-style setup and experiment with
>> bringing together professional journalists and community contributors to
>> produce fact-checked, global news stories.
>>
>
> This (and particularly the name "Wikitribune") is one of my main concerns.
>
> What defines a wiki is that you edit from the browser, and edits go live
> immediately.  (There are limited exceptions like FlaggedRevisions, but a
> site with 100% FlaggedRevisions is not a wiki, especially if approvals are
> not by the community).
>
> The BBC says, "However, while anybody can make changes to a page, they
> will only go live if a staff member or trusted community volunteer approves
> them."
>
> If this is correct, it is not a wiki, and "wiki-style" is very debatable.
>
> Calling something a wiki when it is not will lead to major brand confusion
> with Wikipedia, particularly given your involvement.
>
> Please clarify the model of the site, so we can assess this further.
>
> Matt Flaschen
>
> (Speaking only for myself in personal capacity.)
>
>
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> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wik
> i/Mailing_lists/Guidelines and https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia-l
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> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] Wikitribune!

Erik Moeller-3
In reply to this post by Jimmy Wales-5
Jimmy-

I think it's a great initiative! First, kudos for using the CC-BY
license. I have reviewed a large number of nonprofit journalism
outlets over the last few months [1], and this decision alone would
set the project apart from even the public interest media sphere.
There are only a few nonprofit news/journalism projects using a free
or semi-free license, e.g.:

- Common Dreams (lefty/progressive site) uses CC-BY-SA
- Mosaic (science publication) uses CC-BY
- The Conversation (sort of a nonprofit/academic Vox.com) uses CC-BY-ND
- ProPublica uses CC-BY-NC-ND
- Aeon (science/philosophy) uses CC-BY-ND for some content

But for the most part, even nonprofit publications tend to use
conventional copyright, making it difficult for Wikimedia and other
free culture projects to collaborate with them (and of course the more
restrictive CC licenses above are not Wikimedia-compatible either).

I hope the license will apply to photographs/videos as well as text,
since a lot of media files will be of immediate value to the free
culture world.

Second, kudos for not paywalling the content. A lot of people seem to
re-discover the idea of paywalls in 100 different forms and sell it as
innovative. Again, it prevents collaboration with other communities.

There's no mention in the FAQ as to whether WikiTribune will be
nonprofit or not, or whether that's even on the table. I am guessing
the answer is no, but it would be good to clarify that. Similarly, it
would be good to make any commitment to the development/use of open
source software beyond WordPress explicit.

Good luck raising the $/supporter goal and hopefully launching the
site, will definitely be keeping an eye on it. :)

Warmly,
Erik

[1] https://lib.reviews/team/nonprofit-media/feed

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