[Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

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[Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

John Mark Vandenberg
"On Wed, Dec 2, 2015 at 6:14 PM, K. Peachey <[hidden email]> wrote:
> I might have missed it, but I can't see any attribution for the image… as I
> doubt it will be a click through to the file page.

I couldnt find the image in

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Cups_of_black_coffee

The image is only on donate.wikimedia.org, uploaded by "BHouse
(Trilogy)", which I assume means they are an employee of
http://www.trilogyinteractive.com (see previous years Form 990):

https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead.jpg

It appears to be a stock photo, by photographer Dimitrios Stefanidis.

http://tineye.com/search/2267feed8737197d64056553011261b75ef34a9e/

http://www.istockphoto.com/photo/coffee-on-white-25228505

So my hopeful guess WMF bought a licence to the photograph, but even
that would be inappropriate IMO.

It wouldnt have been hard to make a free photo of a coffee, or even
create a derivative of this lovely CC0 SVG

https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Cup_of_Coffee.svg

(assuming the license is correct; I cant see CC0 on
http://rejke.deviantart.com/art/Coffee-384565868)

--
John Vandenberg

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Marc-Andre
On 15-12-02 09:46 AM, John Mark Vandenberg wrote:
> It wouldnt have been hard to make a free photo of a coffee, or even
> create a derivative of this lovely CC0 SVG

I don't think I'm concerned about the foundation fundraising staff
deciding to use a stock photo - expedience and all, but I'm pretty sure
that had they known about that (absolutely gorgeous) SVG, they'd have
used it.

... which I guess is my way of saying "OMG commons actually *sucks* for
reuse because it's so hard to find stuff on it that many people no
longer even try!!1!one!".

-- Marc


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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Gnangarra
29 million photos, 30 seconds type category:coffee cups
https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Coffee_cups  90 photos
subcategory cups of coffee a further 700 images not really difficult to
find or navigate to what you need.

There is no excuse for fundraising team to not use a Free licensed
photograph and message to the community they are suppose to be trying to
support and promote either on commons-l or here sayo=ing they need an image
of a cup of coffee from above would have got them even more to choose from,

On 2 December 2015 at 22:53, Marc A. Pelletier <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 15-12-02 09:46 AM, John Mark Vandenberg wrote:
> > It wouldnt have been hard to make a free photo of a coffee, or even
> > create a derivative of this lovely CC0 SVG
>
> I don't think I'm concerned about the foundation fundraising staff
> deciding to use a stock photo - expedience and all, but I'm pretty sure
> that had they known about that (absolutely gorgeous) SVG, they'd have
> used it.
>
> ... which I guess is my way of saying "OMG commons actually *sucks* for
> reuse because it's so hard to find stuff on it that many people no
> longer even try!!1!one!".
>
> -- Marc
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>



--
GN.
President Wikimedia Australia
WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra
Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Gerard Meijssen-3
Hoi,
There is an excuse. You may know those categories, I do not and I do not
even try to find images in Commons for my blog. It is too hard to find
things. The search is neither efficient nor intuitive.

For me Commons and Wikisource could do with an abundant sprinkling of
improved user interface. It is geared up for people adding data not really
for people using data. The approach is way too dogmatic as well. So no,
thank you.
Thanks,
      GerardM

On 2 December 2015 at 23:56, Gnangarra <[hidden email]> wrote:

> 29 million photos, 30 seconds type category:coffee cups
> https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Coffee_cups  90 photos
> subcategory cups of coffee a further 700 images not really difficult to
> find or navigate to what you need.
>
> There is no excuse for fundraising team to not use a Free licensed
> photograph and message to the community they are suppose to be trying to
> support and promote either on commons-l or here sayo=ing they need an image
> of a cup of coffee from above would have got them even more to choose from,
>
> On 2 December 2015 at 22:53, Marc A. Pelletier <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > On 15-12-02 09:46 AM, John Mark Vandenberg wrote:
> > > It wouldnt have been hard to make a free photo of a coffee, or even
> > > create a derivative of this lovely CC0 SVG
> >
> > I don't think I'm concerned about the foundation fundraising staff
> > deciding to use a stock photo - expedience and all, but I'm pretty sure
> > that had they known about that (absolutely gorgeous) SVG, they'd have
> > used it.
> >
> > ... which I guess is my way of saying "OMG commons actually *sucks* for
> > reuse because it's so hard to find stuff on it that many people no
> > longer even try!!1!one!".
> >
> > -- Marc
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> >
>
>
>
> --
> GN.
> President Wikimedia Australia
> WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra
> Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Gnangarra
There is a big difference here between an individual and the Wikimedia
Foundation using Wikimedia Commons

On 3 December 2015 at 07:03, Gerard Meijssen <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Hoi,
> There is an excuse. You may know those categories, I do not and I do not
> even try to find images in Commons for my blog. It is too hard to find
> things. The search is neither efficient nor intuitive.
>
> For me Commons and Wikisource could do with an abundant sprinkling of
> improved user interface. It is geared up for people adding data not really
> for people using data. The approach is way too dogmatic as well. So no,
> thank you.
> Thanks,
>       GerardM
>
> On 2 December 2015 at 23:56, Gnangarra <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > 29 million photos, 30 seconds type category:coffee cups
> > https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Coffee_cups  90 photos
> > subcategory cups of coffee a further 700 images not really difficult to
> > find or navigate to what you need.
> >
> > There is no excuse for fundraising team to not use a Free licensed
> > photograph and message to the community they are suppose to be trying to
> > support and promote either on commons-l or here sayo=ing they need an
> image
> > of a cup of coffee from above would have got them even more to choose
> from,
> >
> > On 2 December 2015 at 22:53, Marc A. Pelletier <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > On 15-12-02 09:46 AM, John Mark Vandenberg wrote:
> > > > It wouldnt have been hard to make a free photo of a coffee, or even
> > > > create a derivative of this lovely CC0 SVG
> > >
> > > I don't think I'm concerned about the foundation fundraising staff
> > > deciding to use a stock photo - expedience and all, but I'm pretty sure
> > > that had they known about that (absolutely gorgeous) SVG, they'd have
> > > used it.
> > >
> > > ... which I guess is my way of saying "OMG commons actually *sucks* for
> > > reuse because it's so hard to find stuff on it that many people no
> > > longer even try!!1!one!".
> > >
> > > -- Marc
> > >
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > > [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > GN.
> > President Wikimedia Australia
> > WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra
> > Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>



--
GN.
President Wikimedia Australia
WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra
Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com
_______________________________________________
Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Gerard Meijssen-3
Hoi,
It is. I am one of the people who agitated for Commons to be created in the
first place. I care about Commons and I hate the lack of usability with a
passion. Wikimedians on the other hand cost us additional money in order to
cope with Commons.

What is your problem in acknowledging that using Commons is a big problem.
It is so bad that I typically refuse to add categories because they are not
easy to guess and therefore to apply. At some stage it is at least what I
hoped for, a repository for use for WMF projects. As a re-use facility it
is a failure.
Thanks,
       GerardM

On 3 December 2015 at 00:09, Gnangarra <[hidden email]> wrote:

> There is a big difference here between an individual and the Wikimedia
> Foundation using Wikimedia Commons
>
> On 3 December 2015 at 07:03, Gerard Meijssen <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
>
> > Hoi,
> > There is an excuse. You may know those categories, I do not and I do not
> > even try to find images in Commons for my blog. It is too hard to find
> > things. The search is neither efficient nor intuitive.
> >
> > For me Commons and Wikisource could do with an abundant sprinkling of
> > improved user interface. It is geared up for people adding data not
> really
> > for people using data. The approach is way too dogmatic as well. So no,
> > thank you.
> > Thanks,
> >       GerardM
> >
> > On 2 December 2015 at 23:56, Gnangarra <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >
> > > 29 million photos, 30 seconds type category:coffee cups
> > > https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Coffee_cups  90 photos
> > > subcategory cups of coffee a further 700 images not really difficult to
> > > find or navigate to what you need.
> > >
> > > There is no excuse for fundraising team to not use a Free licensed
> > > photograph and message to the community they are suppose to be trying
> to
> > > support and promote either on commons-l or here sayo=ing they need an
> > image
> > > of a cup of coffee from above would have got them even more to choose
> > from,
> > >
> > > On 2 December 2015 at 22:53, Marc A. Pelletier <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> > >
> > > > On 15-12-02 09:46 AM, John Mark Vandenberg wrote:
> > > > > It wouldnt have been hard to make a free photo of a coffee, or even
> > > > > create a derivative of this lovely CC0 SVG
> > > >
> > > > I don't think I'm concerned about the foundation fundraising staff
> > > > deciding to use a stock photo - expedience and all, but I'm pretty
> sure
> > > > that had they known about that (absolutely gorgeous) SVG, they'd have
> > > > used it.
> > > >
> > > > ... which I guess is my way of saying "OMG commons actually *sucks*
> for
> > > > reuse because it's so hard to find stuff on it that many people no
> > > > longer even try!!1!one!".
> > > >
> > > > -- Marc
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > > > [hidden email]
> > > > Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > GN.
> > > President Wikimedia Australia
> > > WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra
> > > Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > > [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > >
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> >
>
>
>
> --
> GN.
> President Wikimedia Australia
> WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra
> Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
_______________________________________________
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Jane Darnell
This is exactly why we need "Stuctured Data for Commons" and I for one was
really disappointed to see it get tossed onto the back burner yet again:
https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/2015_Community_Wishlist_Survey/Archive#Structured_metadata_for_Commons

On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 6:35 AM, Gerard Meijssen <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> Hoi,
> It is. I am one of the people who agitated for Commons to be created in the
> first place. I care about Commons and I hate the lack of usability with a
> passion. Wikimedians on the other hand cost us additional money in order to
> cope with Commons.
>
> What is your problem in acknowledging that using Commons is a big problem.
> It is so bad that I typically refuse to add categories because they are not
> easy to guess and therefore to apply. At some stage it is at least what I
> hoped for, a repository for use for WMF projects. As a re-use facility it
> is a failure.
> Thanks,
>        GerardM
>
> On 3 December 2015 at 00:09, Gnangarra <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > There is a big difference here between an individual and the Wikimedia
> > Foundation using Wikimedia Commons
> >
> > On 3 December 2015 at 07:03, Gerard Meijssen <[hidden email]>
> > wrote:
> >
> > > Hoi,
> > > There is an excuse. You may know those categories, I do not and I do
> not
> > > even try to find images in Commons for my blog. It is too hard to find
> > > things. The search is neither efficient nor intuitive.
> > >
> > > For me Commons and Wikisource could do with an abundant sprinkling of
> > > improved user interface. It is geared up for people adding data not
> > really
> > > for people using data. The approach is way too dogmatic as well. So no,
> > > thank you.
> > > Thanks,
> > >       GerardM
> > >
> > > On 2 December 2015 at 23:56, Gnangarra <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > >
> > > > 29 million photos, 30 seconds type category:coffee cups
> > > > https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/Category:Coffee_cups  90 photos
> > > > subcategory cups of coffee a further 700 images not really difficult
> to
> > > > find or navigate to what you need.
> > > >
> > > > There is no excuse for fundraising team to not use a Free licensed
> > > > photograph and message to the community they are suppose to be trying
> > to
> > > > support and promote either on commons-l or here sayo=ing they need an
> > > image
> > > > of a cup of coffee from above would have got them even more to choose
> > > from,
> > > >
> > > > On 2 December 2015 at 22:53, Marc A. Pelletier <[hidden email]>
> > wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > On 15-12-02 09:46 AM, John Mark Vandenberg wrote:
> > > > > > It wouldnt have been hard to make a free photo of a coffee, or
> even
> > > > > > create a derivative of this lovely CC0 SVG
> > > > >
> > > > > I don't think I'm concerned about the foundation fundraising staff
> > > > > deciding to use a stock photo - expedience and all, but I'm pretty
> > sure
> > > > > that had they known about that (absolutely gorgeous) SVG, they'd
> have
> > > > > used it.
> > > > >
> > > > > ... which I guess is my way of saying "OMG commons actually *sucks*
> > for
> > > > > reuse because it's so hard to find stuff on it that many people no
> > > > > longer even try!!1!one!".
> > > > >
> > > > > -- Marc
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > > > > [hidden email]
> > > > > Unsubscribe:
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > > <mailto:[hidden email]
> ?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > GN.
> > > > President Wikimedia Australia
> > > > WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra
> > > > Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > > > [hidden email]
> > > > Unsubscribe:
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > > [hidden email]
> > > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > GN.
> > President Wikimedia Australia
> > WMAU: http://www.wikimedia.org.au/wiki/User:Gnangarra
> > Photo Gallery: http://gnangarra.redbubble.com
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> > https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> > <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> >
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Andrea Zanni-2
In reply to this post by Gerard Meijssen-3
On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 12:03 AM, Gerard Meijssen <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> For me Commons and Wikisource could do with an abundant sprinkling of
> improved user interface.
>

Well, of course.
But, from where I see it, this is something to be address centrally:
Commons and Wikisource communities are fairly small and at least in
Wikisource we don't have any volunteer designers or UX people. The amount
of staff time dedicated from the WMF to Wikisource is zero, from the
beginning (I don't know about Commons). So, yes, you're right, but this is
not a problem that communities can solve by themselves.

Aubrey

(sorry for the OT)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Pine W
Under the redesigned grants scheme, WMF Project grants might be able to
help with this kind of software development work for Commons and/or
Wikisource. I happen to know a developer here in Cascadia who might be
interested, either as an individual or in association with a Wikimedia
affiliate, in doing this kind of work on a grant or contract basis.

Pinging Kacie for comment about possible grant funding. (:

Pine
On Dec 3, 2015 00:55, "Andrea Zanni" <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 12:03 AM, Gerard Meijssen <[hidden email]>
wrote:

> For me Commons and Wikisource could do with an abundant sprinkling of
> improved user interface.
>

Well, of course.
But, from where I see it, this is something to be address centrally:
Commons and Wikisource communities are fairly small and at least in
Wikisource we don't have any volunteer designers or UX people. The amount
of staff time dedicated from the WMF to Wikisource is zero, from the
beginning (I don't know about Commons). So, yes, you're right, but this is
not a problem that communities can solve by themselves.

Aubrey

(sorry for the OT)
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Andrea Zanni-2
On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 10:09 AM, Pine W <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Under the redesigned grants scheme, WMF Project grants might be able to
> help with this kind of software development work for Commons and/or
> Wikisource. I happen to know a developer here in Cascadia who might be
> interested, either as an individual or in association with a Wikimedia
> affiliate, in doing this kind of work on a grant or contract basis.
>
> Pinging Kacie for comment about possible grant funding. (:
>


Hi Pine, thanks for the comment.
I understand what you mean, and I do believe there is space to work on
Wikisource via grants, BUT.

But I already did a Individual Engagement Grant in 2013 (with David Cuenca)
regarding Wikisource.
It was great, but IEGs don't give you staff time. So me and David used
Google Summer of Code, and we mentored 4 projects: if I'm not mistaken,
only one was really finished, meaning it produced concrete results on
Wikisource. Others stopped before (for example, two dedicated mediawiki
extensions were not put in production). Within the IEG, we made a big
survey among Wikisource communities, to develop a wishlist and a roadmap
for WS communities. We set up a Wikisource Community User Group. We talked
and talked. Bugs were and are reported, from years. Two weeks ago, we
convened the very first internationl Wikisource conference, in Vienna,
hosted by Wikimedia Austria (3 members from WMF were there, and we had a
great and productive time, reports will follow).

I've personally been involved in all of these efforts, so I've also seen
that real impact of Wikisource infrastructure (core WS extension, design,
interface, performance, development) has been minimal. I don't really want
to have this conversation here and now, but I have had a fair amount of
experience in this to say that until the WMF (or some affiliate big enough
and high enough in the software pipeline) commit to WS, change won't
magically happen by itself. We have practically one real volunteer
developer, and he's full of work to do (also, I already asked him if he
would like to receive a grant to work on certain issues, and he can't, and
he's the only one who could do that, thanks to his unique experience).

Grant works for little things, I'm afraid. Major change requires something
else.

Aubrey
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Gerard Meijssen-3
Hoi,
It is that time of year where money is asked from the people. Arguably we
would do more when the Wikimedia foundation was not so FF-ing Wikipedia
centred.The arguments for not giving Wikisource have passed their sell by
date and usability for exposing its wonderful work is imho a disfigurement
on the resume of the WMF (among others). This is a cheap one to fix. It
makes sense to fix it as I understand sources are part of "Wikimedia Zero"
and it would make a world of a difference when the sources can actually be
found.

Unicef among others has fundraising campaigns for education because it is
not its most important priority. As long as kids die because of lack of
food, safe water, preventable disease and temperature it is obvious why.
Such an excuse the WMF does not have. It could ask for additional funding
for Wikisource, for Wikidata for ... and it would have a solid argument.
Thanks,
      GerardM

On 3 December 2015 at 10:25, Andrea Zanni <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 10:09 AM, Pine W <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Under the redesigned grants scheme, WMF Project grants might be able to
> > help with this kind of software development work for Commons and/or
> > Wikisource. I happen to know a developer here in Cascadia who might be
> > interested, either as an individual or in association with a Wikimedia
> > affiliate, in doing this kind of work on a grant or contract basis.
> >
> > Pinging Kacie for comment about possible grant funding. (:
> >
>
>
> Hi Pine, thanks for the comment.
> I understand what you mean, and I do believe there is space to work on
> Wikisource via grants, BUT.
>
> But I already did a Individual Engagement Grant in 2013 (with David Cuenca)
> regarding Wikisource.
> It was great, but IEGs don't give you staff time. So me and David used
> Google Summer of Code, and we mentored 4 projects: if I'm not mistaken,
> only one was really finished, meaning it produced concrete results on
> Wikisource. Others stopped before (for example, two dedicated mediawiki
> extensions were not put in production). Within the IEG, we made a big
> survey among Wikisource communities, to develop a wishlist and a roadmap
> for WS communities. We set up a Wikisource Community User Group. We talked
> and talked. Bugs were and are reported, from years. Two weeks ago, we
> convened the very first internationl Wikisource conference, in Vienna,
> hosted by Wikimedia Austria (3 members from WMF were there, and we had a
> great and productive time, reports will follow).
>
> I've personally been involved in all of these efforts, so I've also seen
> that real impact of Wikisource infrastructure (core WS extension, design,
> interface, performance, development) has been minimal. I don't really want
> to have this conversation here and now, but I have had a fair amount of
> experience in this to say that until the WMF (or some affiliate big enough
> and high enough in the software pipeline) commit to WS, change won't
> magically happen by itself. We have practically one real volunteer
> developer, and he's full of work to do (also, I already asked him if he
> would like to receive a grant to work on certain issues, and he can't, and
> he's the only one who could do that, thanks to his unique experience).
>
> Grant works for little things, I'm afraid. Major change requires something
> else.
>
> Aubrey
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

gamaliel8
I don't think this rises to the level of outrage, but it's a little
important.  The goal of the WMF should be to promote free and open
content, and this adds to the perception that the WMF is disconnected
from those goals and the community.  I don't care if they use a stock
photo if they need to, but when they have smart, capable, and creative
people like Victor Grigas on staff, they can certainly manage to
photograph a cup of coffee and release it as a CC photo to set a good
example for the community and movement.

On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 4:41 AM, Gerard Meijssen
<[hidden email]> wrote:

> Hoi,
> It is that time of year where money is asked from the people. Arguably we
> would do more when the Wikimedia foundation was not so FF-ing Wikipedia
> centred.The arguments for not giving Wikisource have passed their sell by
> date and usability for exposing its wonderful work is imho a disfigurement
> on the resume of the WMF (among others). This is a cheap one to fix. It
> makes sense to fix it as I understand sources are part of "Wikimedia Zero"
> and it would make a world of a difference when the sources can actually be
> found.
>
> Unicef among others has fundraising campaigns for education because it is
> not its most important priority. As long as kids die because of lack of
> food, safe water, preventable disease and temperature it is obvious why.
> Such an excuse the WMF does not have. It could ask for additional funding
> for Wikisource, for Wikidata for ... and it would have a solid argument.
> Thanks,
>       GerardM
>
> On 3 December 2015 at 10:25, Andrea Zanni <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 10:09 AM, Pine W <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>
>> > Under the redesigned grants scheme, WMF Project grants might be able to
>> > help with this kind of software development work for Commons and/or
>> > Wikisource. I happen to know a developer here in Cascadia who might be
>> > interested, either as an individual or in association with a Wikimedia
>> > affiliate, in doing this kind of work on a grant or contract basis.
>> >
>> > Pinging Kacie for comment about possible grant funding. (:
>> >
>>
>>
>> Hi Pine, thanks for the comment.
>> I understand what you mean, and I do believe there is space to work on
>> Wikisource via grants, BUT.
>>
>> But I already did a Individual Engagement Grant in 2013 (with David Cuenca)
>> regarding Wikisource.
>> It was great, but IEGs don't give you staff time. So me and David used
>> Google Summer of Code, and we mentored 4 projects: if I'm not mistaken,
>> only one was really finished, meaning it produced concrete results on
>> Wikisource. Others stopped before (for example, two dedicated mediawiki
>> extensions were not put in production). Within the IEG, we made a big
>> survey among Wikisource communities, to develop a wishlist and a roadmap
>> for WS communities. We set up a Wikisource Community User Group. We talked
>> and talked. Bugs were and are reported, from years. Two weeks ago, we
>> convened the very first internationl Wikisource conference, in Vienna,
>> hosted by Wikimedia Austria (3 members from WMF were there, and we had a
>> great and productive time, reports will follow).
>>
>> I've personally been involved in all of these efforts, so I've also seen
>> that real impact of Wikisource infrastructure (core WS extension, design,
>> interface, performance, development) has been minimal. I don't really want
>> to have this conversation here and now, but I have had a fair amount of
>> experience in this to say that until the WMF (or some affiliate big enough
>> and high enough in the software pipeline) commit to WS, change won't
>> magically happen by itself. We have practically one real volunteer
>> developer, and he's full of work to do (also, I already asked him if he
>> would like to receive a grant to work on certain issues, and he can't, and
>> he's the only one who could do that, thanks to his unique experience).
>>
>> Grant works for little things, I'm afraid. Major change requires something
>> else.
>>
>> Aubrey
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> [hidden email]
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
> _______________________________________________
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> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Lisa Gruwell
We agree with you that WMF fundraising should not use stock photography.
This was a mistake by a designer.  We specify in our contracts with outside
designers that the images used should be custom artwork that WMF owns (and
can then share) or freely licensed images.  We pulled that banner yesterday
and asked our designers for a new custom image that we can freely license.
We are running another banner with a custom light bulb image at 100% now.
This artwork will be added to Commons.   We also have a few new banners
featuring some beautiful Commons images that are under development:   Stars
<https://en.wikipedia.org/?banner=B1516_0916_en6C_dsk_p1_lg_strinf&force=1&country=US>
, Penguin
<https://en.wikipedia.org/?banner=B1516_0916_en6C_dsk_p1_lg_pngsml&force=1&country=US>
 Thank
you for pointing this out to us.



Best,

Lisa

On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 10:58 AM, Rob <[hidden email]> wrote:

> I don't think this rises to the level of outrage, but it's a little
> important.  The goal of the WMF should be to promote free and open
> content, and this adds to the perception that the WMF is disconnected
> from those goals and the community.  I don't care if they use a stock
> photo if they need to, but when they have smart, capable, and creative
> people like Victor Grigas on staff, they can certainly manage to
> photograph a cup of coffee and release it as a CC photo to set a good
> example for the community and movement.
>
> On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 4:41 AM, Gerard Meijssen
> <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Hoi,
> > It is that time of year where money is asked from the people. Arguably we
> > would do more when the Wikimedia foundation was not so FF-ing Wikipedia
> > centred.The arguments for not giving Wikisource have passed their sell by
> > date and usability for exposing its wonderful work is imho a
> disfigurement
> > on the resume of the WMF (among others). This is a cheap one to fix. It
> > makes sense to fix it as I understand sources are part of "Wikimedia
> Zero"
> > and it would make a world of a difference when the sources can actually
> be
> > found.
> >
> > Unicef among others has fundraising campaigns for education because it is
> > not its most important priority. As long as kids die because of lack of
> > food, safe water, preventable disease and temperature it is obvious why.
> > Such an excuse the WMF does not have. It could ask for additional funding
> > for Wikisource, for Wikidata for ... and it would have a solid argument.
> > Thanks,
> >       GerardM
> >
> > On 3 December 2015 at 10:25, Andrea Zanni <[hidden email]>
> wrote:
> >
> >> On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 10:09 AM, Pine W <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >>
> >> > Under the redesigned grants scheme, WMF Project grants might be able
> to
> >> > help with this kind of software development work for Commons and/or
> >> > Wikisource. I happen to know a developer here in Cascadia who might be
> >> > interested, either as an individual or in association with a Wikimedia
> >> > affiliate, in doing this kind of work on a grant or contract basis.
> >> >
> >> > Pinging Kacie for comment about possible grant funding. (:
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >> Hi Pine, thanks for the comment.
> >> I understand what you mean, and I do believe there is space to work on
> >> Wikisource via grants, BUT.
> >>
> >> But I already did a Individual Engagement Grant in 2013 (with David
> Cuenca)
> >> regarding Wikisource.
> >> It was great, but IEGs don't give you staff time. So me and David used
> >> Google Summer of Code, and we mentored 4 projects: if I'm not mistaken,
> >> only one was really finished, meaning it produced concrete results on
> >> Wikisource. Others stopped before (for example, two dedicated mediawiki
> >> extensions were not put in production). Within the IEG, we made a big
> >> survey among Wikisource communities, to develop a wishlist and a roadmap
> >> for WS communities. We set up a Wikisource Community User Group. We
> talked
> >> and talked. Bugs were and are reported, from years. Two weeks ago, we
> >> convened the very first internationl Wikisource conference, in Vienna,
> >> hosted by Wikimedia Austria (3 members from WMF were there, and we had a
> >> great and productive time, reports will follow).
> >>
> >> I've personally been involved in all of these efforts, so I've also seen
> >> that real impact of Wikisource infrastructure (core WS extension,
> design,
> >> interface, performance, development) has been minimal. I don't really
> want
> >> to have this conversation here and now, but I have had a fair amount of
> >> experience in this to say that until the WMF (or some affiliate big
> enough
> >> and high enough in the software pipeline) commit to WS, change won't
> >> magically happen by itself. We have practically one real volunteer
> >> developer, and he's full of work to do (also, I already asked him if he
> >> would like to receive a grant to work on certain issues, and he can't,
> and
> >> he's the only one who could do that, thanks to his unique experience).
> >>
> >> Grant works for little things, I'm afraid. Major change requires
> something
> >> else.
> >>
> >> Aubrey
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> >> [hidden email]
> >> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> >> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> >>
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> > [hidden email]
> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

geni
On 3 December 2015 at 19:29, Lisa Gruwell <[hidden email]> wrote:

> We agree with you that WMF fundraising should not use stock photography.
> This was a mistake by a designer.
>

They made a mistake with a Getty image?

>We pulled that banner yesterday
>and asked our designers for a new custom image that we can freely license.

To clarify these are different designers? Messing with Getty is not
something you want to be doing.

--
geni
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

gamaliel8
In reply to this post by Lisa Gruwell
Excellent (and prompt) resolution, thank you!  We can all put down our
pitchforks now.

On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 2:29 PM, Lisa Gruwell <[hidden email]> wrote:

> We agree with you that WMF fundraising should not use stock photography.
> This was a mistake by a designer.  We specify in our contracts with outside
> designers that the images used should be custom artwork that WMF owns (and
> can then share) or freely licensed images.  We pulled that banner yesterday
> and asked our designers for a new custom image that we can freely license.
> We are running another banner with a custom light bulb image at 100% now.
> This artwork will be added to Commons.   We also have a few new banners
> featuring some beautiful Commons images that are under development:   Stars
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/?banner=B1516_0916_en6C_dsk_p1_lg_strinf&force=1&country=US>
> , Penguin
> <https://en.wikipedia.org/?banner=B1516_0916_en6C_dsk_p1_lg_pngsml&force=1&country=US>
>  Thank
> you for pointing this out to us.
>
>
>
> Best,
>
> Lisa
>
> On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 10:58 AM, Rob <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
>> I don't think this rises to the level of outrage, but it's a little
>> important.  The goal of the WMF should be to promote free and open
>> content, and this adds to the perception that the WMF is disconnected
>> from those goals and the community.  I don't care if they use a stock
>> photo if they need to, but when they have smart, capable, and creative
>> people like Victor Grigas on staff, they can certainly manage to
>> photograph a cup of coffee and release it as a CC photo to set a good
>> example for the community and movement.
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 4:41 AM, Gerard Meijssen
>> <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> > Hoi,
>> > It is that time of year where money is asked from the people. Arguably we
>> > would do more when the Wikimedia foundation was not so FF-ing Wikipedia
>> > centred.The arguments for not giving Wikisource have passed their sell by
>> > date and usability for exposing its wonderful work is imho a
>> disfigurement
>> > on the resume of the WMF (among others). This is a cheap one to fix. It
>> > makes sense to fix it as I understand sources are part of "Wikimedia
>> Zero"
>> > and it would make a world of a difference when the sources can actually
>> be
>> > found.
>> >
>> > Unicef among others has fundraising campaigns for education because it is
>> > not its most important priority. As long as kids die because of lack of
>> > food, safe water, preventable disease and temperature it is obvious why.
>> > Such an excuse the WMF does not have. It could ask for additional funding
>> > for Wikisource, for Wikidata for ... and it would have a solid argument.
>> > Thanks,
>> >       GerardM
>> >
>> > On 3 December 2015 at 10:25, Andrea Zanni <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>> >
>> >> On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 10:09 AM, Pine W <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> > Under the redesigned grants scheme, WMF Project grants might be able
>> to
>> >> > help with this kind of software development work for Commons and/or
>> >> > Wikisource. I happen to know a developer here in Cascadia who might be
>> >> > interested, either as an individual or in association with a Wikimedia
>> >> > affiliate, in doing this kind of work on a grant or contract basis.
>> >> >
>> >> > Pinging Kacie for comment about possible grant funding. (:
>> >> >
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> Hi Pine, thanks for the comment.
>> >> I understand what you mean, and I do believe there is space to work on
>> >> Wikisource via grants, BUT.
>> >>
>> >> But I already did a Individual Engagement Grant in 2013 (with David
>> Cuenca)
>> >> regarding Wikisource.
>> >> It was great, but IEGs don't give you staff time. So me and David used
>> >> Google Summer of Code, and we mentored 4 projects: if I'm not mistaken,
>> >> only one was really finished, meaning it produced concrete results on
>> >> Wikisource. Others stopped before (for example, two dedicated mediawiki
>> >> extensions were not put in production). Within the IEG, we made a big
>> >> survey among Wikisource communities, to develop a wishlist and a roadmap
>> >> for WS communities. We set up a Wikisource Community User Group. We
>> talked
>> >> and talked. Bugs were and are reported, from years. Two weeks ago, we
>> >> convened the very first internationl Wikisource conference, in Vienna,
>> >> hosted by Wikimedia Austria (3 members from WMF were there, and we had a
>> >> great and productive time, reports will follow).
>> >>
>> >> I've personally been involved in all of these efforts, so I've also seen
>> >> that real impact of Wikisource infrastructure (core WS extension,
>> design,
>> >> interface, performance, development) has been minimal. I don't really
>> want
>> >> to have this conversation here and now, but I have had a fair amount of
>> >> experience in this to say that until the WMF (or some affiliate big
>> enough
>> >> and high enough in the software pipeline) commit to WS, change won't
>> >> magically happen by itself. We have practically one real volunteer
>> >> developer, and he's full of work to do (also, I already asked him if he
>> >> would like to receive a grant to work on certain issues, and he can't,
>> and
>> >> he's the only one who could do that, thanks to his unique experience).
>> >>
>> >> Grant works for little things, I'm afraid. Major change requires
>> something
>> >> else.
>> >>
>> >> Aubrey
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> >> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> >> [hidden email]
>> >> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> >> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>> >>
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> > [hidden email]
>> > Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> [hidden email]
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
> _______________________________________________
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> [hidden email]
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

John Mark Vandenberg
In reply to this post by Lisa Gruwell
"On Fri, Dec 4, 2015 at 6:29 AM, Lisa Gruwell <[hidden email]> wrote:
> We agree with you that WMF fundraising should not use stock photography.
> This was a mistake by a designer.  We specify in our contracts with outside
> designers that the images used should be custom artwork that WMF owns (and
> can then share) or freely licensed images.

Someone needed to approve purchasing the stock photograph.  They are
not free...?  Was it WMF or Trilogy?
Even if it was Trilogy, WMF sanity check processes are also not
working.  Surely someone at WMF is responsible for QA of the images
used in fundraising?

https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:ListFiles shows this stock
photograph was uploaded to donate.wikimedia.org many times, and worked
on by WMF staff members.

https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:10-coffee-txt-thepricekeepswikithriving.jpg
- SPatton (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:03-coffee-txt-goingallyear.jpg
- SPatton (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Newgreen.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greencoffeecup-alt.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greencoffeecup-4.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead-redcup.jpg
- SPatton (WMF) (marked as CC-BY-SA; is that legal with the Getty
Image?)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-3dollars.jpg -
RStearns (Trilogy)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-small.jpg -
RStearns (Trilogy)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-no-text.jpg -
BHouse (Trilogy)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-small.png -
RStearns (Trilogy)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-faites_v1.png - Jseddon (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-offrez_v2.png - Jseddon (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-offrez_v1.png - Jseddon (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-oggi_offri_v2.png -
Jseddon (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-oggi_offri_v1.png -
Jseddon (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-dona_caffe_v2.png -
Jseddon (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-dona_caffe_v1.png -
Jseddon (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-en-donate_coffee_v2.png
- Jseddon (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-en-donate_coffee_v1.png
- Jseddon (WMF)
https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead.jpg -
BHouse (Trilogy)

Jseddon uploaded several alternative coffee cup photographs to
donate.wikimedia.org (no metadata, but they look like his own work...,
and not too shabby) . How did a stock photograph become selected over
other options, and ownership/copyright was never raised during those
selection discussions?

That is a lot of donor money wasted by someone somehow deciding to use
a Getty image as part of a multimillion dollor fundraising drive for
an organisation supporting "It is like a library or a public park. It
is like a temple for the mind. It is a place we can all go to think,
to learn, to share our knowledge with others."

I do hope your contract with the external design company allows you to
reclaim the wasted donor money caused by their violation of the
contract regarding image selection.

"We’ve worked hard over the years to keep it lean and tight. We
fulfill our mission, and leave waste to others."

> We pulled that banner yesterday

Thank you.

> and asked our designers for a new custom image that we can freely license.

Why not use the Coffee SVG I found (very easily I must say)?

> We are running another banner with a custom light bulb image at 100% now.
> This artwork will be added to Commons.

IMO they should be uploaded to Commons first, with full metadata, and
create a workflow added around begging the Commons community to
prioritise checking these images quickly so they can be used in the
fundraiser.  That was how it was done before donate.wikimedia.org ,
when wikimediafoundation.org was used for these uploads, and that wiki
had a significant volunteer community assisting in maintenance.

Uploads to donate.wikimedia.org should either be limited to people
competent in copyright and responsible for that aspect, or at the very
least the upload forms should require that metadata is filled in, and
someone at WMF checks new additions regularly.

--
John Vandenberg

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

gamaliel8
I doubt the selection of a single image occupied that much staff time
and discussion.  No process is perfect. This is a small thing, that
was quickly fixed.  I doubt a lot of money was wasted here.

On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 4:11 PM, John Mark Vandenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:

> "On Fri, Dec 4, 2015 at 6:29 AM, Lisa Gruwell <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> We agree with you that WMF fundraising should not use stock photography.
>> This was a mistake by a designer.  We specify in our contracts with outside
>> designers that the images used should be custom artwork that WMF owns (and
>> can then share) or freely licensed images.
>
> Someone needed to approve purchasing the stock photograph.  They are
> not free...?  Was it WMF or Trilogy?
> Even if it was Trilogy, WMF sanity check processes are also not
> working.  Surely someone at WMF is responsible for QA of the images
> used in fundraising?
>
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:ListFiles shows this stock
> photograph was uploaded to donate.wikimedia.org many times, and worked
> on by WMF staff members.
>
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:10-coffee-txt-thepricekeepswikithriving.jpg
> - SPatton (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:03-coffee-txt-goingallyear.jpg
> - SPatton (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Newgreen.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greencoffeecup-alt.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greencoffeecup-4.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead-redcup.jpg
> - SPatton (WMF) (marked as CC-BY-SA; is that legal with the Getty
> Image?)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-3dollars.jpg -
> RStearns (Trilogy)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-small.jpg -
> RStearns (Trilogy)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-no-text.jpg -
> BHouse (Trilogy)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-small.png -
> RStearns (Trilogy)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-faites_v1.png - Jseddon (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-offrez_v2.png - Jseddon (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-offrez_v1.png - Jseddon (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-oggi_offri_v2.png -
> Jseddon (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-oggi_offri_v1.png -
> Jseddon (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-dona_caffe_v2.png -
> Jseddon (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-dona_caffe_v1.png -
> Jseddon (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-en-donate_coffee_v2.png
> - Jseddon (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-en-donate_coffee_v1.png
> - Jseddon (WMF)
> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead.jpg -
> BHouse (Trilogy)
>
> Jseddon uploaded several alternative coffee cup photographs to
> donate.wikimedia.org (no metadata, but they look like his own work...,
> and not too shabby) . How did a stock photograph become selected over
> other options, and ownership/copyright was never raised during those
> selection discussions?
>
> That is a lot of donor money wasted by someone somehow deciding to use
> a Getty image as part of a multimillion dollor fundraising drive for
> an organisation supporting "It is like a library or a public park. It
> is like a temple for the mind. It is a place we can all go to think,
> to learn, to share our knowledge with others."
>
> I do hope your contract with the external design company allows you to
> reclaim the wasted donor money caused by their violation of the
> contract regarding image selection.
>
> "We’ve worked hard over the years to keep it lean and tight. We
> fulfill our mission, and leave waste to others."
>
>> We pulled that banner yesterday
>
> Thank you.
>
>> and asked our designers for a new custom image that we can freely license.
>
> Why not use the Coffee SVG I found (very easily I must say)?
>
>> We are running another banner with a custom light bulb image at 100% now.
>> This artwork will be added to Commons.
>
> IMO they should be uploaded to Commons first, with full metadata, and
> create a workflow added around begging the Commons community to
> prioritise checking these images quickly so they can be used in the
> fundraiser.  That was how it was done before donate.wikimedia.org ,
> when wikimediafoundation.org was used for these uploads, and that wiki
> had a significant volunteer community assisting in maintenance.
>
> Uploads to donate.wikimedia.org should either be limited to people
> competent in copyright and responsible for that aspect, or at the very
> least the upload forms should require that metadata is filled in, and
> someone at WMF checks new additions regularly.
>
> --
> John Vandenberg
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Bohdan Melnychuk
That is not a small thing. That is an enormous thing. We show people
some unfree image while propagating free stuff. Hypocrisy? We are
speaking about thousands of people seeing it.

It is good that the stuff was removed, but from my point of view that
another image with link to an external site rather than to Commons is
still a very bad thing. It reminds me those games where ads are ways
better than the game itself.

Commons must contain the images used to help funding projects one of
which is Commons.

Another disturbing point indeed is WMF hiding on all these wikis like
donatewiki, votewiki
<https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Forum/Archives/2015-06#License_policy_abuse_on_votewiki>and
similar where it freely violates its own licensing policy and where they
are safe from the community.

It looks like WMF has some pleasure from spitting on some of the values
which define it and which are very important for us. For me to look on
these particular mentioned wikis, to see a bad abuse there and to be
able to do nothing is very humiliating.

I just cannot imagine such things to be mistakes. If it after all is a
mistake then it's systematical one and something with the organization
is wrong. Wrong things are those which need fixes.

--Base

On 03.12.2015 23:49, Rob wrote:

> I doubt the selection of a single image occupied that much staff time
> and discussion.  No process is perfect. This is a small thing, that
> was quickly fixed.  I doubt a lot of money was wasted here.
>
> On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 4:11 PM, John Mark Vandenberg <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> "On Fri, Dec 4, 2015 at 6:29 AM, Lisa Gruwell <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>> We agree with you that WMF fundraising should not use stock photography.
>>> This was a mistake by a designer.  We specify in our contracts with outside
>>> designers that the images used should be custom artwork that WMF owns (and
>>> can then share) or freely licensed images.
>> Someone needed to approve purchasing the stock photograph.  They are
>> not free...?  Was it WMF or Trilogy?
>> Even if it was Trilogy, WMF sanity check processes are also not
>> working.  Surely someone at WMF is responsible for QA of the images
>> used in fundraising?
>>
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:ListFiles shows this stock
>> photograph was uploaded to donate.wikimedia.org many times, and worked
>> on by WMF staff members.
>>
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:10-coffee-txt-thepricekeepswikithriving.jpg
>> - SPatton (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:03-coffee-txt-goingallyear.jpg
>> - SPatton (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Newgreen.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greencoffeecup-alt.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greencoffeecup-4.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead-redcup.jpg
>> - SPatton (WMF) (marked as CC-BY-SA; is that legal with the Getty
>> Image?)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-3dollars.jpg -
>> RStearns (Trilogy)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-small.jpg -
>> RStearns (Trilogy)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-no-text.jpg -
>> BHouse (Trilogy)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-small.png -
>> RStearns (Trilogy)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-faites_v1.png - Jseddon (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-offrez_v2.png - Jseddon (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-offrez_v1.png - Jseddon (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-oggi_offri_v2.png -
>> Jseddon (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-oggi_offri_v1.png -
>> Jseddon (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-dona_caffe_v2.png -
>> Jseddon (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-dona_caffe_v1.png -
>> Jseddon (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-en-donate_coffee_v2.png
>> - Jseddon (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-en-donate_coffee_v1.png
>> - Jseddon (WMF)
>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead.jpg -
>> BHouse (Trilogy)
>>
>> Jseddon uploaded several alternative coffee cup photographs to
>> donate.wikimedia.org (no metadata, but they look like his own work...,
>> and not too shabby) . How did a stock photograph become selected over
>> other options, and ownership/copyright was never raised during those
>> selection discussions?
>>
>> That is a lot of donor money wasted by someone somehow deciding to use
>> a Getty image as part of a multimillion dollor fundraising drive for
>> an organisation supporting "It is like a library or a public park. It
>> is like a temple for the mind. It is a place we can all go to think,
>> to learn, to share our knowledge with others."
>>
>> I do hope your contract with the external design company allows you to
>> reclaim the wasted donor money caused by their violation of the
>> contract regarding image selection.
>>
>> "We’ve worked hard over the years to keep it lean and tight. We
>> fulfill our mission, and leave waste to others."
>>
>>> We pulled that banner yesterday
>> Thank you.
>>
>>> and asked our designers for a new custom image that we can freely license.
>> Why not use the Coffee SVG I found (very easily I must say)?
>>
>>> We are running another banner with a custom light bulb image at 100% now.
>>> This artwork will be added to Commons.
>> IMO they should be uploaded to Commons first, with full metadata, and
>> create a workflow added around begging the Commons community to
>> prioritise checking these images quickly so they can be used in the
>> fundraiser.  That was how it was done before donate.wikimedia.org ,
>> when wikimediafoundation.org was used for these uploads, and that wiki
>> had a significant volunteer community assisting in maintenance.
>>
>> Uploads to donate.wikimedia.org should either be limited to people
>> competent in copyright and responsible for that aspect, or at the very
>> least the upload forms should require that metadata is filled in, and
>> someone at WMF checks new additions regularly.
>>
>> --
>> John Vandenberg
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> [hidden email]
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at: https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
> [hidden email]
> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l, <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>

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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

Gnangarra
hold it, back up the truck for a moment

If the WMF has a fundraising team and a PR/media team why is it paying a
third party to provide the banners surely someone should be able to design
them in house, what about someone from the design teams working on other
projects.   If no one has the skills to layout a banner why not ask the
community for some options there are many skilled volunteers that would
gladly do it for free, the WMF could even offer a scholarship to Wikimania
as an incentive to get it done within a short time frame.



On 4 December 2015 at 07:11, Bohdan Melnychuk <[hidden email]> wrote:

> That is not a small thing. That is an enormous thing. We show people some
> unfree image while propagating free stuff. Hypocrisy? We are speaking about
> thousands of people seeing it.
>
> It is good that the stuff was removed, but from my point of view that
> another image with link to an external site rather than to Commons is still
> a very bad thing. It reminds me those games where ads are ways better than
> the game itself.
>
> Commons must contain the images used to help funding projects one of which
> is Commons.
>
> Another disturbing point indeed is WMF hiding on all these wikis like
> donatewiki, votewiki <
> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Forum/Archives/2015-06#License_policy_abuse_on_votewiki>and
> similar where it freely violates its own licensing policy and where they
> are safe from the community.
>
> It looks like WMF has some pleasure from spitting on some of the values
> which define it and which are very important for us. For me to look on
> these particular mentioned wikis, to see a bad abuse there and to be able
> to do nothing is very humiliating.
>
> I just cannot imagine such things to be mistakes. If it after all is a
> mistake then it's systematical one and something with the organization is
> wrong. Wrong things are those which need fixes.
>
> --Base
>
>
> On 03.12.2015 23:49, Rob wrote:
>
>> I doubt the selection of a single image occupied that much staff time
>> and discussion.  No process is perfect. This is a small thing, that
>> was quickly fixed.  I doubt a lot of money was wasted here.
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 4:11 PM, John Mark Vandenberg <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> "On Fri, Dec 4, 2015 at 6:29 AM, Lisa Gruwell <[hidden email]>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> We agree with you that WMF fundraising should not use stock photography.
>>>> This was a mistake by a designer.  We specify in our contracts with
>>>> outside
>>>> designers that the images used should be custom artwork that WMF owns
>>>> (and
>>>> can then share) or freely licensed images.
>>>>
>>> Someone needed to approve purchasing the stock photograph.  They are
>>> not free...?  Was it WMF or Trilogy?
>>> Even if it was Trilogy, WMF sanity check processes are also not
>>> working.  Surely someone at WMF is responsible for QA of the images
>>> used in fundraising?
>>>
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:ListFiles shows this stock
>>> photograph was uploaded to donate.wikimedia.org many times, and worked
>>> on by WMF staff members.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:10-coffee-txt-thepricekeepswikithriving.jpg
>>> - SPatton (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:03-coffee-txt-goingallyear.jpg
>>> - SPatton (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Newgreen.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greencoffeecup-alt.jpg - SPatton
>>> (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greencoffeecup-4.jpg - SPatton
>>> (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead-redcup.jpg
>>> - SPatton (WMF) (marked as CC-BY-SA; is that legal with the Getty
>>> Image?)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-3dollars.jpg -
>>> RStearns (Trilogy)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-small.jpg -
>>> RStearns (Trilogy)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-no-text.jpg -
>>> BHouse (Trilogy)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-small.png -
>>> RStearns (Trilogy)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-faites_v1.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-offrez_v2.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-offrez_v1.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-oggi_offri_v2.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-oggi_offri_v1.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-dona_caffe_v2.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-dona_caffe_v1.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-en-donate_coffee_v2.png
>>> - Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-en-donate_coffee_v1.png
>>> - Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead.jpg -
>>> BHouse (Trilogy)
>>>
>>> Jseddon uploaded several alternative coffee cup photographs to
>>> donate.wikimedia.org (no metadata, but they look like his own work...,
>>> and not too shabby) . How did a stock photograph become selected over
>>> other options, and ownership/copyright was never raised during those
>>> selection discussions?
>>>
>>> That is a lot of donor money wasted by someone somehow deciding to use
>>> a Getty image as part of a multimillion dollor fundraising drive for
>>> an organisation supporting "It is like a library or a public park. It
>>> is like a temple for the mind. It is a place we can all go to think,
>>> to learn, to share our knowledge with others."
>>>
>>> I do hope your contract with the external design company allows you to
>>> reclaim the wasted donor money caused by their violation of the
>>> contract regarding image selection.
>>>
>>> "We’ve worked hard over the years to keep it lean and tight. We
>>> fulfill our mission, and leave waste to others."
>>>
>>> We pulled that banner yesterday
>>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>>
>>> and asked our designers for a new custom image that we can freely
>>>> license.
>>>>
>>> Why not use the Coffee SVG I found (very easily I must say)?
>>>
>>> We are running another banner with a custom light bulb image at 100% now.
>>>> This artwork will be added to Commons.
>>>>
>>> IMO they should be uploaded to Commons first, with full metadata, and
>>> create a workflow added around begging the Commons community to
>>> prioritise checking these images quickly so they can be used in the
>>> fundraiser.  That was how it was done before donate.wikimedia.org ,
>>> when wikimediafoundation.org was used for these uploads, and that wiki
>>> had a significant volunteer community assisting in maintenance.
>>>
>>> Uploads to donate.wikimedia.org should either be limited to people
>>> competent in copyright and responsible for that aspect, or at the very
>>> least the upload forms should require that metadata is filled in, and
>>> someone at WMF checks new additions regularly.
>>>
>>> --
>>> John Vandenberg
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>>> [hidden email]
>>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>>> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikimedia-l mailing list, guidelines at:
>> https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Mailing_lists/Guidelines
>> [hidden email]
>> Unsubscribe: https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikimedia-l,
>> <mailto:[hidden email]?subject=unsubscribe>
>>
>
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Re: [Wikimedia-l] (no subject)

gamaliel8
In reply to this post by Bohdan Melnychuk
"It looks like WMF has some pleasure from spitting on some of the
values which define it and which are very important for us. For me to
look on these particular mentioned wikis, to see a bad abuse there and
to be able to do nothing is very humiliating."

It was a photo of a cup of coffee.  It was a mistake that was quickly
acknowledged and corrected.  Let's keep things in perspective, please.

On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 6:11 PM, Bohdan Melnychuk <[hidden email]> wrote:

> That is not a small thing. That is an enormous thing. We show people some
> unfree image while propagating free stuff. Hypocrisy? We are speaking about
> thousands of people seeing it.
>
> It is good that the stuff was removed, but from my point of view that
> another image with link to an external site rather than to Commons is still
> a very bad thing. It reminds me those games where ads are ways better than
> the game itself.
>
> Commons must contain the images used to help funding projects one of which
> is Commons.
>
> Another disturbing point indeed is WMF hiding on all these wikis like
> donatewiki, votewiki
> <https://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikimedia_Forum/Archives/2015-06#License_policy_abuse_on_votewiki>and
> similar where it freely violates its own licensing policy and where they are
> safe from the community.
>
> It looks like WMF has some pleasure from spitting on some of the values
> which define it and which are very important for us. For me to look on these
> particular mentioned wikis, to see a bad abuse there and to be able to do
> nothing is very humiliating.
>
> I just cannot imagine such things to be mistakes. If it after all is a
> mistake then it's systematical one and something with the organization is
> wrong. Wrong things are those which need fixes.
>
> --Base
>
>
> On 03.12.2015 23:49, Rob wrote:
>>
>> I doubt the selection of a single image occupied that much staff time
>> and discussion.  No process is perfect. This is a small thing, that
>> was quickly fixed.  I doubt a lot of money was wasted here.
>>
>> On Thu, Dec 3, 2015 at 4:11 PM, John Mark Vandenberg <[hidden email]>
>> wrote:
>>>
>>> "On Fri, Dec 4, 2015 at 6:29 AM, Lisa Gruwell <[hidden email]>
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> We agree with you that WMF fundraising should not use stock photography.
>>>> This was a mistake by a designer.  We specify in our contracts with
>>>> outside
>>>> designers that the images used should be custom artwork that WMF owns
>>>> (and
>>>> can then share) or freely licensed images.
>>>
>>> Someone needed to approve purchasing the stock photograph.  They are
>>> not free...?  Was it WMF or Trilogy?
>>> Even if it was Trilogy, WMF sanity check processes are also not
>>> working.  Surely someone at WMF is responsible for QA of the images
>>> used in fundraising?
>>>
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/Special:ListFiles shows this stock
>>> photograph was uploaded to donate.wikimedia.org many times, and worked
>>> on by WMF staff members.
>>>
>>>
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:10-coffee-txt-thepricekeepswikithriving.jpg
>>> - SPatton (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:03-coffee-txt-goingallyear.jpg
>>> - SPatton (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Newgreen.jpg - SPatton (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greencoffeecup-alt.jpg - SPatton
>>> (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Greencoffeecup-4.jpg - SPatton
>>> (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead-redcup.jpg
>>> - SPatton (WMF) (marked as CC-BY-SA; is that legal with the Getty
>>> Image?)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-3dollars.jpg -
>>> RStearns (Trilogy)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-small.jpg -
>>> RStearns (Trilogy)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-no-text.jpg -
>>> BHouse (Trilogy)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-overhead-small.png -
>>> RStearns (Trilogy)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-faites_v1.png - Jseddon
>>> (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-offrez_v2.png - Jseddon
>>> (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-fr-offrez_v1.png - Jseddon
>>> (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-oggi_offri_v2.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-oggi_offri_v1.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-dona_caffe_v2.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-it-dona_caffe_v1.png -
>>> Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-en-donate_coffee_v2.png
>>> - Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-en-donate_coffee_v1.png
>>> - Jseddon (WMF)
>>> https://donate.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Coffee-price-overhead.jpg -
>>> BHouse (Trilogy)
>>>
>>> Jseddon uploaded several alternative coffee cup photographs to
>>> donate.wikimedia.org (no metadata, but they look like his own work...,
>>> and not too shabby) . How did a stock photograph become selected over
>>> other options, and ownership/copyright was never raised during those
>>> selection discussions?
>>>
>>> That is a lot of donor money wasted by someone somehow deciding to use
>>> a Getty image as part of a multimillion dollor fundraising drive for
>>> an organisation supporting "It is like a library or a public park. It
>>> is like a temple for the mind. It is a place we can all go to think,
>>> to learn, to share our knowledge with others."
>>>
>>> I do hope your contract with the external design company allows you to
>>> reclaim the wasted donor money caused by their violation of the
>>> contract regarding image selection.
>>>
>>> "We’ve worked hard over the years to keep it lean and tight. We
>>> fulfill our mission, and leave waste to others."
>>>
>>>> We pulled that banner yesterday
>>>
>>> Thank you.
>>>
>>>> and asked our designers for a new custom image that we can freely
>>>> license.
>>>
>>> Why not use the Coffee SVG I found (very easily I must say)?
>>>
>>>> We are running another banner with a custom light bulb image at 100%
>>>> now.
>>>> This artwork will be added to Commons.
>>>
>>> IMO they should be uploaded to Commons first, with full metadata, and
>>> create a workflow added around begging the Commons community to
>>> prioritise checking these images quickly so they can be used in the
>>> fundraiser.  That was how it was done before donate.wikimedia.org ,
>>> when wikimediafoundation.org was used for these uploads, and that wiki
>>> had a significant volunteer community assisting in maintenance.
>>>
>>> Uploads to donate.wikimedia.org should either be limited to people
>>> competent in copyright and responsible for that aspect, or at the very
>>> least the upload forms should require that metadata is filled in, and
>>> someone at WMF checks new additions regularly.
>>>
>>> --
>>> John Vandenberg
>>>
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