[announcement] new staff member in business development

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Thomas Dalton
> Reselling one or two DVD would not be a big deal.
> However, engaging into a real reselling activity of a DVD using
> trademarks which you are not authorized to use for a commercial
> activity, is illegal.

Trademark law would stop me making my own DVDs and selling them as
Wikipedia DVDs, but does it really stop me selling official Wikipedia
DVDs that I own? Having a trademark doesn't give you exclusivity on
using it, it just restricts what other people can use it for. If I'm
talking about Wikipedia, I can use the Wikipedia trademark.

> Yeah, and since your contract agreement at $100 explicitely does not
> allow you to resell the feed to a third party, you would engage into
> illegal activity as well.

That's a much more definite point. A datafeed involves a contractual
agreement between the two parties, so you can impose whatever
restrictions you like. A simple sale of a tangible item does not.

> Datafeed is one of the way we can make money. Which will allow us to pay
> the accountant.
> Which will allow us to provide all the financial information you are
> noisily requesting.
> If you count in "actual cost" uniquely the bandwidth cost, $100 could
> make it. But running an organization uniquely counting as cost, the
> bandwidth, is seriously being out of it.

It's a matter of priorities. Is it more important to get as much free
information as possible out there right now, or to be still able to
get free information out in a year's time? Anthony seems to believe
the former, you the latter. Both are valid points of view.

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Anthony DiPierro
In reply to this post by Florence Devouard-3
On 5/20/07, Florence Devouard <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Anthony wrote:
> > On 5/19/07, Yann Forget <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> Hello,
> >>
> >> Anthony a écrit :
> >> (...)
> >>> But I think the main issue has nothing to do with the IRS.  It's a
> >>> matter of focus.  Developing a profitable business competes with the
> >>> maximum production and distribution of content.  Charging maximum
> >>> prices for data feeds reduces the dissemination of the data.  Charging
> >>> licensing fees to DVD distributors raises the prices of the DVDs and
> >>> thus reduces the number of DVDs which are distributed.  Etc, etc (*).
> >> I think this is false, because we deal with digital and free content.
> >>
> >> It is not because you sell a datafeed to one organisation at one prize
> >> that you sell it to everybody at the same price. Same logic for DVDs.
> >>
> > Interesting.  I don't think that would be feasible for datafeeds
> > though, and I'm pretty sure it isn't feasible for DVDs.  In the case
> > of DVDs, if you tried to sell them to different groups for different
> > prices, you'd simply see people resell the DVDs (engage in arbitrage).
>
> Reselling one or two DVD would not be a big deal.
> However, engaging into a real reselling activity of a DVD using
> trademarks which you are not authorized to use for a commercial
> activity, is illegal.
>
Umm, how so?  Check out eBay sometime, or half.com (have they gotten
rid of that yet?).  People resell DVDs using trademarks which they
aren't authorized to use for a commercial activity *all the time*.
Besides that, it's most certainly not illegal.

> >  I think this would happen for datafeeds as well, if they were ever
> > accessible to the regular public.  If I as an individual could buy an
> > en.wikipedia datafeed for $100/month (which would probably be more
> > than enough to cover WMF's actual costs), the WMF wouldn't be able to
> > charge companies $5000/month, because if they did I'd just step in and
> > resell my $100/month datafeed for much less than $5000.
>
> Yeah, and since your contract agreement at $100 explicitely does not
> allow you to resell the feed to a third party, you would engage into
> illegal activity as well.
>
Then you could sue me, and I'd countersue you for violating the GFDL.
What part of "add no other conditions whatsoever to those of this
License" don't you understand?

If you're currently forcing datafeed recipients to agree not to
redistribute the data they receive, then you're in major breach of the
GFDL.  Not just the relatively minor breaches that have been going on
for so long, but you've subverting the very essence of copyleft.

I seriously hope your current contracts don't do that.

> > And I think the WMF *should* be willing to sell unrestricted datafeeds
> > to *anyone* for little more than its actual costs.  This is in line
> > with maximizing the useful distribution of free content, which is
> > after all the purpose of the WMF.
>
> Datafeed is one of the way we can make money. Which will allow us to pay
> the accountant.
> Which will allow us to provide all the financial information you are
> noisily requesting.

The millions of dollars in donations you've collected is another way
to pay an accountant.

> If you count in "actual cost" uniquely the bandwidth cost, $100 could
> make it. But running an organization uniquely counting as cost, the
> bandwidth, is seriously being out of it.
>
The organization is going to be run regardless of whether or not the
datafeed is given.  Counting all the costs of running the organization
when calculating the marginal cost of providing a datafeed, is
seriously being out of it.

Anthony

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Pyb
In reply to this post by Yann Forget-2
Anthony a écrit :

> On 5/20/07, Florence Devouard <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Anthony wrote:
>>> On 5/19/07, Yann Forget <[hidden email]> wrote:
>>>> Hello,
>>>>
>>>> Anthony a écrit :
>>>> (...)
>>>>> But I think the main issue has nothing to do with the IRS.  It's a
>>>>> matter of focus.  Developing a profitable business competes with the
>>>>> maximum production and distribution of content.  Charging maximum
>>>>> prices for data feeds reduces the dissemination of the data.  Charging
>>>>> licensing fees to DVD distributors raises the prices of the DVDs and
>>>>> thus reduces the number of DVDs which are distributed.  Etc, etc (*).
>>>> I think this is false, because we deal with digital and free content.
>>>>
>>>> It is not because you sell a datafeed to one organisation at one prize
>>>> that you sell it to everybody at the same price. Same logic for DVDs.
>>>>
>>> Interesting.  I don't think that would be feasible for datafeeds
>>> though, and I'm pretty sure it isn't feasible for DVDs.  In the case
>>> of DVDs, if you tried to sell them to different groups for different
>>> prices, you'd simply see people resell the DVDs (engage in arbitrage).
>> Reselling one or two DVD would not be a big deal.
>> However, engaging into a real reselling activity of a DVD using
>> trademarks which you are not authorized to use for a commercial
>> activity, is illegal.
>>
> Umm, how so?  Check out eBay sometime, or half.com (have they gotten
> rid of that yet?).  People resell DVDs using trademarks which they
> aren't authorized to use for a commercial activity *all the time*.
> Besides that, it's most certainly not illegal.
>
>>>  I think this would happen for datafeeds as well, if they were ever
>>> accessible to the regular public.  If I as an individual could buy an
>>> en.wikipedia datafeed for $100/month (which would probably be more
>>> than enough to cover WMF's actual costs), the WMF wouldn't be able to
>>> charge companies $5000/month, because if they did I'd just step in and
>>> resell my $100/month datafeed for much less than $5000.
>> Yeah, and since your contract agreement at $100 explicitely does not
>> allow you to resell the feed to a third party, you would engage into
>> illegal activity as well.
>>
> Then you could sue me, and I'd countersue you for violating the GFDL.
> What part of "add no other conditions whatsoever to those of this
> License" don't you understand?
>
> If you're currently forcing datafeed recipients to agree not to
> redistribute the data they receive, then you're in major breach of the
> GFDL.  Not just the relatively minor breaches that have been going on
> for so long, but you've subverting the very essence of copyleft.
>
> I seriously hope your current contracts don't do that.
>
>>> And I think the WMF *should* be willing to sell unrestricted datafeeds
>>> to *anyone* for little more than its actual costs.  This is in line
>>> with maximizing the useful distribution of free content, which is
>>> after all the purpose of the WMF.
>> Datafeed is one of the way we can make money. Which will allow us to pay
>> the accountant.
>> Which will allow us to provide all the financial information you are
>> noisily requesting.
>
> The millions of dollars in donations you've collected is another way
> to pay an accountant.
>

To be constructive, do you have some ideas to collect more money ? What
should be change during the next fundraising ?

- Should we develop some banners
(http://www2.redcross.org/psa/bannerorder/all/) and ask bloggers and
site owners to add donation ads to websites ?
- Should we do like Firefox (http://www.firefoxgotyourback.com/), but
ask people to pay to "be a pixel" ;)


>> If you count in "actual cost" uniquely the bandwidth cost, $100 could
>> make it. But running an organization uniquely counting as cost, the
>> bandwidth, is seriously being out of it.
>>
> The organization is going to be run regardless of whether or not the
> datafeed is given.  Counting all the costs of running the organization
> when calculating the marginal cost of providing a datafeed, is
> seriously being out of it.
>
> Anthony
>

Pierre
--
Pierre Beaudouin
Président de Wikimédia France
http://www.wikimedia.fr

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

geni
On 5/20/07, Pierre Beaudouin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> To be constructive, do you have some ideas to collect more money ? What
> should be change during the next fundraising ?
>

That argument would have more validity if the foundation showed that
is was paying some attention to say:

http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Fundraising_ideas

and http://meta.wikimedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia.com_draft didn't appear
to have dropped of the radar.

> - Should we develop some banners
> (http://www2.redcross.org/psa/bannerorder/all/) and ask bloggers and
> site owners to add donation ads to websites ?
> - Should we do like Firefox (http://www.firefoxgotyourback.com/), but
> ask people to pay to "be a pixel" ;)

This can be considered as soon as the foundation gives clearance to
use it's IP in this way.

--
geni

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Anthony DiPierro
In reply to this post by Pyb
On 5/20/07, Pierre Beaudouin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> To be constructive, do you have some ideas to collect more money ? What
> should be change during the next fundraising ?
>
First step is to publicly distribute monthly financial statements and
a detailed budget which minimizes unnecessary costs.  The rest of the
details really come from how much if any shortfall results from that.
I suspect there won't be any, so long as the budget really does
minimize unnecessary costs.  Leasing servers instead of purchasing
them is one factor which should help a great deal.

Anthony

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Robert Leverington
Please Anthony, stop being a troll. You are being completely ignorant and rude.

On 20/05/07, Anthony <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 5/20/07, Pierre Beaudouin <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > To be constructive, do you have some ideas to collect more money ? What
> > should be change during the next fundraising ?
> >
> First step is to publicly distribute monthly financial statements and
> a detailed budget which minimizes unnecessary costs.  The rest of the
> details really come from how much if any shortfall results from that.
> I suspect there won't be any, so long as the budget really does
> minimize unnecessary costs.  Leasing servers instead of purchasing
> them is one factor which should help a great deal.
>
> Anthony
>
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>


--
Robert[hl] [[User:Lcarsdata]]
http://roberthl.wikitest.co.uk/

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Alison M. Wheeler
On Sun, May 20, 2007 13:26, Robert Leverington wrote:
> Please Anthony, stop being a troll. You are being completely ignorant and
> rude.

Seconded.

> On 20/05/07, Anthony <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Leasing servers instead of purchasing
>> them is one factor which should help a great deal.

Leasing equipment is what you do when you need the option to be able to
cancel it should trading conditions turn against you and you no longer
need the equipment (which is not the case with WMF - we *know* that our
usage will continue to increase not decrease) -or- you want to be able to
mark down the lease / interest payments against your tax liability, again
which does not apply to WMF.

As Robert got to saying first, please be constructive and don't troll.

Alison Wheeler


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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Gerard Meijssen-3
In reply to this post by Thomas Dalton
Hoi,
What Anthony conveniently forgets is how we are going to pay for it all.
Yes, we want to get as much expose our data in as many ways as possible.
That is something we agree on. Fact is that the WMF is underfunded, it could
do much more if it had money to act on its convictions.
Thanks,
    GerardM

On 5/20/07, Thomas Dalton <[hidden email]> wrote:

>
> It's a matter of priorities. Is it more important to get as much free
> information as possible out there right now, or to be still able to
> get free information out in a year's time? Anthony seems to believe
> the former, you the latter. Both are valid points of view.
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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Casey Brown-2
In reply to this post by Alison M. Wheeler
Thirded, but I think it is quite obvious from my responses to Anthony that I
think he is a troll.

Cbrown1023

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Alison
Wheeler
Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2007 9:03 AM
To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] [announcement] new staff member in business
development

On Sun, May 20, 2007 13:26, Robert Leverington wrote:
> Please Anthony, stop being a troll. You are being completely ignorant and
> rude.

Seconded.

> On 20/05/07, Anthony <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Leasing servers instead of purchasing
>> them is one factor which should help a great deal.

Leasing equipment is what you do when you need the option to be able to
cancel it should trading conditions turn against you and you no longer
need the equipment (which is not the case with WMF - we *know* that our
usage will continue to increase not decrease) -or- you want to be able to
mark down the lease / interest payments against your tax liability, again
which does not apply to WMF.

As Robert got to saying first, please be constructive and don't troll.

Alison Wheeler


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Re: [announcement] new staff member in businessdevelopment

Casey Brown-2
In reply to this post by Anthony DiPierro
You seriously do not understand the inner-workings of this organization.  We
do not have "millions of dollars" right now, we have enough to get by and
probably some more, but we definitely do not have the large amount you are
talking about.  Please look up the prices of the servers alone and the
maintenance that needs to be done on them.  If you do not understand
something, ask, don't incorrectly point a rude finger.

Casey Brown
Cbrown1023

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Anthony
Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2007 7:46 AM
To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] [announcement] new staff member in
businessdevelopment

> > And I think the WMF *should* be willing to sell unrestricted datafeeds
> > to *anyone* for little more than its actual costs.  This is in line
> > with maximizing the useful distribution of free content, which is
> > after all the purpose of the WMF.
>
> Datafeed is one of the way we can make money. Which will allow us to pay
> the accountant.
> Which will allow us to provide all the financial information you are
> noisily requesting.

The millions of dollars in donations you've collected is another way
to pay an accountant.




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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Anthony DiPierro
In reply to this post by Gerard Meijssen-3
On 5/20/07, GerardM <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Hoi,
> What Anthony conveniently forgets is how we are going to pay for it all.

Pay for what?  The stuff that's being done now?  Donations are going
to pay for it.  For giving a datafeed to anyone in the world?  The
people receiving the datafeeds will pay for it.

Imagine being able to get cheap or even free hosting on a multi-user
server which has a live datafeed.  Toolserver has given us a glimpse
of the possibilites, now imagine if thousands of people had shell
access.

> Yes, we want to get as much expose our data in as many ways as possible.
> That is something we agree on. Fact is that the WMF is underfunded, it could
> do much more if it had money to act on its convictions.

Underfunded/overfunded is relative, but I do agree with you that the
WMF could do much more if it had more money.  But it's not fair to
artificially restrict current projects in order to get that money.

Anthony

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in businessdevelopment

Anthony DiPierro
In reply to this post by Anthony DiPierro
On 5/20/07, Casey Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:
> You seriously do not understand the inner-workings of this organization.  We
> do not have "millions of dollars" right now, we have enough to get by and
> probably some more, but we definitely do not have the large amount you are
> talking about.

I'm sorry if I implied that the WMF currently had "millions of
dollars".  The fact is I have no idea how much the WMF currently has,
as it stopped regular disclosure of this information years ago and
hasn't yet resumed doing so.

It doesn't cost millions of dollars to hire an accountant, though.

> Please look up the prices of the servers alone and the
> maintenance that needs to be done on them.  If you do not understand
> something, ask, don't incorrectly point a rude finger.
>
I've read the previous financial statements.  In each case the revenue
collected exceeded the expenses.

Anthony

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in businessdevelopment

Casey Brown-2
In reply to this post by Anthony DiPierro
I disagree, it *is* fair to postpone projects for the good of and to insure
the longevity of the organization as a whole.  Otherwise, the effects of
these projects will be short-lived.

Cbrown1023

-----Original Message-----
From: [hidden email]
[mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Anthony
Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2007 9:42 AM
To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List
Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] [announcement] new staff member in
businessdevelopment

On 5/20/07, GerardM <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Hoi,
> What Anthony conveniently forgets is how we are going to pay for it all.

Pay for what?  The stuff that's being done now?  Donations are going
to pay for it.  For giving a datafeed to anyone in the world?  The
people receiving the datafeeds will pay for it.

Imagine being able to get cheap or even free hosting on a multi-user
server which has a live datafeed.  Toolserver has given us a glimpse
of the possibilites, now imagine if thousands of people had shell
access.

> Yes, we want to get as much expose our data in as many ways as possible.
> That is something we agree on. Fact is that the WMF is underfunded, it
could
> do much more if it had money to act on its convictions.

Underfunded/overfunded is relative, but I do agree with you that the
WMF could do much more if it had more money.  But it's not fair to
artificially restrict current projects in order to get that money.

Anthony

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Robert Leverington
In reply to this post by Anthony DiPierro
On 20/05/07, Anthony <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 5/20/07, GerardM <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > Hoi,
> > What Anthony conveniently forgets is how we are going to pay for it all.
>
> Pay for what?  The stuff that's being done now?  Donations are going
> to pay for it.  For giving a datafeed to anyone in the world?  The
> people receiving the datafeeds will pay for it.
> Imagine being able to get cheap or even free hosting on a multi-user
> server which has a live datafeed.  Toolserver has given us a glimpse
> of the possibilites, now imagine if thousands of people had shell
> access.

We are not disagreeing with your ideas, I am sure they could work, but
consider how much money starting up a project like that would cost. At
the moment the servers for the current wikis aren't good enough - let
alone thousands of other websites using who know how much storage and
CPU.

>
> > Yes, we want to get as much expose our data in as many ways as possible.
> > That is something we agree on. Fact is that the WMF is underfunded, it could
> > do much more if it had money to act on its convictions.
>
> Underfunded/overfunded is relative, but I do agree with you that the
> WMF could do much more if it had more money.  But it's not fair to
> artificially restrict current projects in order to get that money.
>
> Anthony
>
> _______________________________________________
> foundation-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
>


--
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http://roberthl.wikitest.co.uk/

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Anthony DiPierro
On 5/20/07, Robert Leverington <[hidden email]> wrote:

> On 20/05/07, Anthony <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > On 5/20/07, GerardM <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > > Hoi,
> > > What Anthony conveniently forgets is how we are going to pay for it all.
> >
> > Pay for what?  The stuff that's being done now?  Donations are going
> > to pay for it.  For giving a datafeed to anyone in the world?  The
> > people receiving the datafeeds will pay for it.
> > Imagine being able to get cheap or even free hosting on a multi-user
> > server which has a live datafeed.  Toolserver has given us a glimpse
> > of the possibilites, now imagine if thousands of people had shell
> > access.
>
> We are not disagreeing with your ideas, I am sure they could work, but
> consider how much money starting up a project like that would cost. At
> the moment the servers for the current wikis aren't good enough - let
> alone thousands of other websites using who know how much storage and
> CPU.
>
All the WMF would have to do is offer a datafeed at cost.  Then let
someone else run the toolserver.  The storage required would only need
to hold a single copy of the data.  CPU scale about linerally, but you
could hold a lot of users on a single machine.

Hell, if the WMF will give me a datafeed at twice its cost without any
restrictions on reselling it, I'll set it up myself.

Anthony

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Michael Bimmler
In reply to this post by Alison M. Wheeler
On 5/20/07, Casey Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:
> Thirded, but I think it is quite obvious from my responses to Anthony that I
> think he is a troll.
>
This is nothing personal against you but can we stop this right now?
If anyone else wants to talk to Anthony about whether he is a "troll"
or not, do it in private and *off-list*.
I have already said this in a post to the list once
(http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2007-May/030030.html)
and I repeat my statement: Accusing each other of trolling in public
only stimulates flame wars and is not
in any other way helpful to this list. The next unlucky person who
decides to entertain the list with ad personam comments about other
subscribers risks being moderated.

Thank you
Michael


> Cbrown1023
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: [hidden email]
> [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Alison
> Wheeler
> Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2007 9:03 AM
> To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] [announcement] new staff member in business
> development
>
> On Sun, May 20, 2007 13:26, Robert Leverington wrote:
> > Please Anthony, stop being a troll. You are being completely ignorant and
> > rude.
>
> Seconded.
>
> > On 20/05/07, Anthony <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> Leasing servers instead of purchasing
> >> them is one factor which should help a great deal.
>
> Leasing equipment is what you do when you need the option to be able to
> cancel it should trading conditions turn against you and you no longer
> need the equipment (which is not the case with WMF - we *know* that our
> usage will continue to increase not decrease) -or- you want to be able to
> mark down the lease / interest payments against your tax liability, again
> which does not apply to WMF.
>
> As Robert got to saying first, please be constructive and don't troll.
>
> Alison Wheeler
>
>
> _______________________________________________
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Re: [announcement] new staff member in businessdevelopment

Florence Devouard-3
In reply to this post by Anthony DiPierro
Anthony wrote:

> On 5/20/07, Casey Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> You seriously do not understand the inner-workings of this organization.  We
>> do not have "millions of dollars" right now, we have enough to get by and
>> probably some more, but we definitely do not have the large amount you are
>> talking about.
>
> I'm sorry if I implied that the WMF currently had "millions of
> dollars".  The fact is I have no idea how much the WMF currently has,
> as it stopped regular disclosure of this information years ago and
> hasn't yet resumed doing so.


WMF is regularly disclosing information about the MILLIONS of dollars
raised by donations.

Regularly is probably about every minute or so.

Please check http://fundraising.wikimedia.org/

There is history of donations since january 2006.
Prior data may be found in audited financial statements for the past 3
years, available here: http://wikimediafoundation.org/wiki/Finance_report

The donation website was set up end of 2006. It is a huge improvement
over past reporting system.

Ant


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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Michael Bimmler
In reply to this post by Michael Bimmler
On 5/20/07, Michael Bimmler <[hidden email]> wrote:

> This is nothing personal against you but can we stop this right now?
> If anyone else wants to talk to Anthony about whether he is a "troll"
> or not, do it in private and *off-list*.
> I have already said this in a post to the list once
> (http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2007-May/030030.html)
> and I repeat my statement: Accusing each other of trolling in public
> only stimulates flame wars and is not
> in any other way helpful to this list. The next unlucky person who
> decides to entertain the list with ad personam comments about other
> subscribers risks being moderated.
>
Note, if this isn't clear enough: This also covers defamatory (ad
personam) comments against board members, the board as a whole,
Wikimedia Foundation staff (members and as a whole), committees etc
etc.

I certainly think that discussion is a good thing and I do not wish to
censor critical comments, even I think it is highly important that the
Foundation is open, transparent and open to public criticism. But this
needs be done with a certain decency, respect and should be done in a
constructive rather than destructive way.

Michael

>Thank you
> Michael
>
>
> > Cbrown1023
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: [hidden email]
> > [mailto:[hidden email]] On Behalf Of Alison
> > Wheeler
> > Sent: Sunday, May 20, 2007 9:03 AM
> > To: Wikimedia Foundation Mailing List
> > Subject: Re: [Foundation-l] [announcement] new staff member in business
> > development
> >
> > On Sun, May 20, 2007 13:26, Robert Leverington wrote:
> > > Please Anthony, stop being a troll. You are being completely ignorant and
> > > rude.
> >
> > Seconded.
> >
> > > On 20/05/07, Anthony <[hidden email]> wrote:
> > >> Leasing servers instead of purchasing
> > >> them is one factor which should help a great deal.
> >
> > Leasing equipment is what you do when you need the option to be able to
> > cancel it should trading conditions turn against you and you no longer
> > need the equipment (which is not the case with WMF - we *know* that our
> > usage will continue to increase not decrease) -or- you want to be able to
> > mark down the lease / interest payments against your tax liability, again
> > which does not apply to WMF.
> >
> > As Robert got to saying first, please be constructive and don't troll.
> >
> > Alison Wheeler
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > foundation-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > foundation-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > http://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/foundation-l
> >
>

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Re: [announcement] new staff member in business development

Florence Devouard-3
In reply to this post by Michael Bimmler
Michael Bimmler wrote:

> On 5/20/07, Casey Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> Thirded, but I think it is quite obvious from my responses to Anthony that I
>> think he is a troll.
>>
> This is nothing personal against you but can we stop this right now?
> If anyone else wants to talk to Anthony about whether he is a "troll"
> or not, do it in private and *off-list*.
> I have already said this in a post to the list once
> (http://lists.wikimedia.org/pipermail/foundation-l/2007-May/030030.html)
> and I repeat my statement: Accusing each other of trolling in public
> only stimulates flame wars and is not
> in any other way helpful to this list. The next unlucky person who
> decides to entertain the list with ad personam comments about other
> subscribers risks being moderated.
>
> Thank you
> Michael

Hmmm.

Right.

Sure.

Well.

Anthony is currently trolling.

Ant


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Re: [announcement] new staff member in businessdevelopment

Anthony DiPierro
In reply to this post by Florence Devouard-3
On 5/20/07, Florence Devouard <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Anthony wrote:
> > On 5/20/07, Casey Brown <[hidden email]> wrote:
> >> You seriously do not understand the inner-workings of this organization.  We
> >> do not have "millions of dollars" right now, we have enough to get by and
> >> probably some more, but we definitely do not have the large amount you are
> >> talking about.
> >
> > I'm sorry if I implied that the WMF currently had "millions of
> > dollars".  The fact is I have no idea how much the WMF currently has,
> > as it stopped regular disclosure of this information years ago and
> > hasn't yet resumed doing so.
>
> WMF is regularly disclosing information about the MILLIONS of dollars
> raised by donations.
>
Amount raised by donations is only one part of a calculation of how
much the foundation currently has.

Any idea how much the cost is to the WMF to add a datafeed client?  As
I've said, I'm willing to put my money where my mouth is.  Give me a
datafeed, at 2x cost, with no restrictions on reselling it.  I'll set
up a non-profit organization dedicated to distributing the data, and
I'll take out a $25,000 personal loan at prosper.com which I'll turn
around and reloan to the non-profit at the same interest rate.  I'll
then set up a server with a MySQL database containing the data and
offer shell accounts on the server for $10/month.

Deal?

Anthony

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