!ask

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!ask

Ori Livneh
Can we deprecate usage of '!ask' on IRC?

> ori-l: !ask
> wm-bot: Hi, how can we help you? Just ask your question.

It's annoying when people ask to ask, but the people who do so do it out of
insecurity or lack of experience, and so they're the last people we should
be siccing our bots on.

I've used '!ask' a lot before but I'm going to stop. I hope others do the
same.
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Re: !ask

Tyler Romeo
Yeah I agree. Whenever I see it used I cringe a little bit thinking about
how the other person is reading it.

--Tyler Romeo
On Jul 23, 2013 5:51 PM, "Ori Livneh" <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Can we deprecate usage of '!ask' on IRC?
>
> > ori-l: !ask
> > wm-bot: Hi, how can we help you? Just ask your question.
>
> It's annoying when people ask to ask, but the people who do so do it out of
> insecurity or lack of experience, and so they're the last people we should
> be siccing our bots on.
>
> I've used '!ask' a lot before but I'm going to stop. I hope others do the
> same.
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
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Re: !ask

Chad
[14:54] <^demon> !ask del
[14:54] <wm-bot> Successfully removed ask

-Chad

On Tue, Jul 23, 2013 at 2:53 PM, Tyler Romeo <[hidden email]> wrote:

> Yeah I agree. Whenever I see it used I cringe a little bit thinking about
> how the other person is reading it.
>
> --Tyler Romeo
> On Jul 23, 2013 5:51 PM, "Ori Livneh" <[hidden email]> wrote:
>
> > Can we deprecate usage of '!ask' on IRC?
> >
> > > ori-l: !ask
> > > wm-bot: Hi, how can we help you? Just ask your question.
> >
> > It's annoying when people ask to ask, but the people who do so do it out
> of
> > insecurity or lack of experience, and so they're the last people we
> should
> > be siccing our bots on.
> >
> > I've used '!ask' a lot before but I'm going to stop. I hope others do the
> > same.
> > _______________________________________________
> > Wikitech-l mailing list
> > [hidden email]
> > https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
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Re: !ask

MZMcBride-2
In reply to this post by Ori Livneh
Ori Livneh wrote:

>Can we deprecate usage of '!ask' on IRC?
>
>> ori-l: !ask
>> wm-bot: Hi, how can we help you? Just ask your question.
>
>It's annoying when people ask to ask, but the people who do so do it out
>of insecurity or lack of experience, and so they're the last people we
>should be siccing our bots on.
>
>I've used '!ask' a lot before but I'm going to stop. I hope others do the
>same.

So really you're going for !!ask.

"!ask" used to be more direct (some would say meaner) and I'm a little sad
to see it go away, but I suppose snotty replies can always be made
manually. ;-)

MZMcBride



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Re: !ask

Jay Ashworth-2
----- Original Message -----
> From: "MZMcBride" <[hidden email]>

> >I've used '!ask' a lot before but I'm going to stop. I hope others do
> >the same.
>
> So really you're going for !!ask.
>
> "!ask" used to be more direct (some would say meaner) and I'm a little
> sad to see it go away, but I suppose snotty replies can always be made
> manually. ;-)

Well, perhaps if it expanded as "IRC is a worldwide network, and many users
are logged into it while doing other things.  Ask your question, supplying
as much detail as possible, and one of them may reply, even if it takes a
while.  In other words: don't ask to ask, just ask."...?

Cheers,
-- jra
--
Jay R. Ashworth                  Baylink                       [hidden email]
Designer                     The Things I Think                       RFC 2100
Ashworth & Associates       http://www.bcp38.info          2000 Land Rover DII
St Petersburg FL USA      BCP38: Ask For It By Name!           +1 727 647 1274

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Re: !ask

Petr Bena
There is one more feature available on wm-bot.

First of all, that thing is smart enough to recognize who is irc
newbie and who is not. It is possible to direct this only to people
who are known to the bot (their cloak is trusted) so that it doesn't
bite the newbies, but rather "slap" the experienced who keep bad
habits. The bot is able to recognize what is a "question if they can
ask" and automatically tell the person to ask the question instead of
asking if they can ask, for example:

[08:23] <petan2> hi I have a question
[08:23] <+wm-bot> Hi petan2, just ask! There is no need to ask if you can ask
________________________________
[08:24] <petan2> is someone here
[08:24] <+wm-bot> Hi petan2, I am here, if you need anything, please
ask, otherwise no one is going to help you... Thank you

I admit that having a bot for this may not be a best solution, having
more active helpers would be better, but I think that having people
who just come to channel, say someone here? and immediately quit after
5 minutes of no response is even worse

On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 5:39 AM, Jay Ashworth <[hidden email]> wrote:

> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "MZMcBride" <[hidden email]>
>
>> >I've used '!ask' a lot before but I'm going to stop. I hope others do
>> >the same.
>>
>> So really you're going for !!ask.
>>
>> "!ask" used to be more direct (some would say meaner) and I'm a little
>> sad to see it go away, but I suppose snotty replies can always be made
>> manually. ;-)
>
> Well, perhaps if it expanded as "IRC is a worldwide network, and many users
> are logged into it while doing other things.  Ask your question, supplying
> as much detail as possible, and one of them may reply, even if it takes a
> while.  In other words: don't ask to ask, just ask."...?
>
> Cheers,
> -- jra
> --
> Jay R. Ashworth                  Baylink                       [hidden email]
> Designer                     The Things I Think                       RFC 2100
> Ashworth & Associates       http://www.bcp38.info          2000 Land Rover DII
> St Petersburg FL USA      BCP38: Ask For It By Name!           +1 727 647 1274
>
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

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Re: !ask

Petr Bena
this can be of course improved, if someone is interested:

https://github.com/benapetr/wikimedia-bot/blob/master/plugins/slap/slap/Class1.cs

On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 8:26 AM, Petr Bena <[hidden email]> wrote:

> There is one more feature available on wm-bot.
>
> First of all, that thing is smart enough to recognize who is irc
> newbie and who is not. It is possible to direct this only to people
> who are known to the bot (their cloak is trusted) so that it doesn't
> bite the newbies, but rather "slap" the experienced who keep bad
> habits. The bot is able to recognize what is a "question if they can
> ask" and automatically tell the person to ask the question instead of
> asking if they can ask, for example:
>
> [08:23] <petan2> hi I have a question
> [08:23] <+wm-bot> Hi petan2, just ask! There is no need to ask if you can ask
> ________________________________
> [08:24] <petan2> is someone here
> [08:24] <+wm-bot> Hi petan2, I am here, if you need anything, please
> ask, otherwise no one is going to help you... Thank you
>
> I admit that having a bot for this may not be a best solution, having
> more active helpers would be better, but I think that having people
> who just come to channel, say someone here? and immediately quit after
> 5 minutes of no response is even worse
>
> On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 5:39 AM, Jay Ashworth <[hidden email]> wrote:
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "MZMcBride" <[hidden email]>
>>
>>> >I've used '!ask' a lot before but I'm going to stop. I hope others do
>>> >the same.
>>>
>>> So really you're going for !!ask.
>>>
>>> "!ask" used to be more direct (some would say meaner) and I'm a little
>>> sad to see it go away, but I suppose snotty replies can always be made
>>> manually. ;-)
>>
>> Well, perhaps if it expanded as "IRC is a worldwide network, and many users
>> are logged into it while doing other things.  Ask your question, supplying
>> as much detail as possible, and one of them may reply, even if it takes a
>> while.  In other words: don't ask to ask, just ask."...?
>>
>> Cheers,
>> -- jra
>> --
>> Jay R. Ashworth                  Baylink                       [hidden email]
>> Designer                     The Things I Think                       RFC 2100
>> Ashworth & Associates       http://www.bcp38.info          2000 Land Rover DII
>> St Petersburg FL USA      BCP38: Ask For It By Name!           +1 727 647 1274
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Wikitech-l mailing list
>> [hidden email]
>> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

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Re: !ask

Bináris
In reply to this post by Petr Bena
2014/1/20 Petr Bena <[hidden email]>

>
>
> [08:23] <petan2> hi I have a question
> [08:23] <+wm-bot> Hi petan2, just ask! There is no need to ask if you can
> ask
> ________________________________
> [08:24] <petan2> is someone here
> [08:24] <+wm-bot> Hi petan2, I am here, if you need anything, please
> ask, otherwise no one is going to help you... Thank you
>
>
Moreover, the bot should be taught to answer standard FAQ questions on its
own. :-)
And the next step is a real AI. :-)
--
Bináris
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Re: !ask

Jasper Deng
In #digitalocean on freenode, their bot says "Don't ask to ask." or
something like that.


On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 12:10 AM, Bináris <[hidden email]> wrote:

> 2014/1/20 Petr Bena <[hidden email]>
>
> >
> >
> > [08:23] <petan2> hi I have a question
> > [08:23] <+wm-bot> Hi petan2, just ask! There is no need to ask if you can
> > ask
> > ________________________________
> > [08:24] <petan2> is someone here
> > [08:24] <+wm-bot> Hi petan2, I am here, if you need anything, please
> > ask, otherwise no one is going to help you... Thank you
> >
> >
> Moreover, the bot should be taught to answer standard FAQ questions on its
> own. :-)
> And the next step is a real AI. :-)
> --
> Bináris
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l
>
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Re: !ask

Petr Bena
In reply to this post by Bináris
yes I was trying to implement AI using some open source libraries, but
there aren't many of them and they all pretty much suck. Every AI
project that works is usually proprietary.

On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 9:10 AM, Bináris <[hidden email]> wrote:

> 2014/1/20 Petr Bena <[hidden email]>
>
>>
>>
>> [08:23] <petan2> hi I have a question
>> [08:23] <+wm-bot> Hi petan2, just ask! There is no need to ask if you can
>> ask
>> ________________________________
>> [08:24] <petan2> is someone here
>> [08:24] <+wm-bot> Hi petan2, I am here, if you need anything, please
>> ask, otherwise no one is going to help you... Thank you
>>
>>
> Moreover, the bot should be taught to answer standard FAQ questions on its
> own. :-)
> And the next step is a real AI. :-)
> --
> Bináris
> _______________________________________________
> Wikitech-l mailing list
> [hidden email]
> https://lists.wikimedia.org/mailman/listinfo/wikitech-l

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Re: !ask

Platonides
In reply to this post by Petr Bena
On 20/01/14 08:26, Petr Bena wrote:
> There is one more feature available on wm-bot.
>
> First of all, that thing is smart enough to recognize who is irc
> newbie and who is not. It is possible to direct this only to people
> who are known to the bot (their cloak is trusted) so that it doesn't
> bite the newbies, but rather "slap" the experienced who keep bad
> habits. The bot is able to recognize what is a "question if they can
> ask" and automatically tell the person to ask the question instead of
> asking if they can ask, for example:

+1
That was precisely what I was going to propose: that the bot should
recognise the original question and answer it itself.
I don't think there's anything wrong in getting a bot inviting  you to
answer. And will be much nicer than having a human tell the bot to
explain you that you can ask :)

Frankly, the reason to do !ask | foobar is basically to avoid looking up
the appropiate template.


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